I am okay with this. Clean air is important. People in NJ already pay more for their gas because we have mandatory attendants. A few cents more for some cleaner air is fine by me.The Obama administration is pushing ahead with a plan to require cleaner gasoline as a way to reduce smog, with the Environmental Protection Agency releasing preliminary rules Friday to reduce sulfur in gas.
The rules would take effect in 2017, and their full impact would be realized a decade later, according to the EPA. An EPA study said the new rule could save 2.000 lives a year and cut back on childhood asthma.
"We estimate the rule will reduce smog by 30%" when fully implemented, said Bill Becker, executive director of the National Association of Clean Air Agencies, which represents air quality control agencies around the country.
Poll: How much would you pay for cleaner air?
A big point of contention is how much the tougher rules would add to the price of gas.
Refinery and oil and gas industry groups have said such a move would force motorists to pay nearly 10 cents more per gallon, based on a study by energy consulting firm Baker & O'Brien.
The White House says the move would add less than a penny a gallon, based on an EPA study.
Representatives of the energy industry disagree.
"There is a tsunami of federal regulations coming out of the EPA that could put upward pressure on gasoline prices," said Bob Greco, a director at the American Petroleum Institute.
Related: Check gas prices in your state
The rule targets sulfur, which occurs naturally in crude oil. The more sulfur, the less efficiently a car runs. The rule would force refineries to reduce sulfur content by more than 60% to 10 parts per million from 30 parts per million, the EPA said.
The National Association of Clean Air Agencies estimates the rule would have the same effect as taking 33 million cars off the roads.
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Lower sulphur is good. They could, of course, offset the price increase by getting rid of the retarded ethanol mandate, but that's not going to happen ever. Too many farmers making too much money off the mandate
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
I just despise the fanciful claims they make in order to justify this stuff: 'up to 2,000 lives could be saved every year!' yeah bullshit.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
they use the same sort of figures when talking about pollution control in major cities like london. it's not that hard to extrapolate. they can estimate a pretty decent figure of people per annum in london, for example, who die of respiratory diseases or related problems that have a clear etiology relating to environmental/air pollution.
No, it's a silly stupid scare tactic. 'up to 2,000' so literally zero or one person's life could be saved and they'd still be correct. I can pretty much guarantee that not a single persons cause of death last year was due to sulphur inhalation from car exhaust.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
they use the same sort of figures when talking about pollution control in major cities like london. it's not that hard to extrapolate. they can estimate a pretty decent figure of people per annum in london, for example, who die of respiratory diseases or related problems that have a clear etiology relating to environmental/air pollution.
I don't mind the regulation, I just despise the method of delivery.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
i'm not sure the cause of death has to be 'sulphur inhalation from car exhaust'. isn't that pretty much a suicide? is that what this rule is trying to prevent? people sucking on harmful car exhausts? there are a lot of respiratory diseases/conditions that one can contract/develop as a result of living in an area with poor air quality, i.e. because of harmful pollutants and emissions from car exhausts. people don't use these figures in london because people are literally dying from "sulphur inhalation".
but okay. the liberal is mad because greenies use liberal-humanist handwringing.
but okay. the liberal is mad because greenies use liberal-humanist handwringing.
I just prefer honesty to scare tactics, that's all.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
yeah rhetoric free honesty and attention to scientific fact has done so much for the green agenda in US politics and industry
they should do something about plastic bags. we have way too much waste. bloomberg tried to place a 5cents/per bag tax but it didn't go through.
I like Bloomberg. He is a man not afraid of doing what needs to be done.
even massive corporations here voluntarily (i think) have 5p charges on plastic bags. that's a universally good idea. people should bring their own fucking plastic bags to the store. or pay for them, at least.
We should all have our own reusable bags made from hemp.
we had it for about a year then it got repealed with a new mayor. most grocery stores kept it on afterwards though. it makes sense, made me start bringing the strong plastic bags that are 1000x easier to carry.
yep. i started buying canvas bags that could carry a lot more and contain everything in one. paid like £8 for it and it has lasted for years of shopping trips. compare that to 5-6 plastic bags every single week i went shopping. no brainer.
Enjoy the e.coli
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
on topic though: they should just reduce the massive subsidies the gas companies get instead of over complicating it like this. take a few billion back a year and spend that on developing greener technologies
gotta love libertarians that prefer their CHOICE IN AMERICUH over the future of the planet
Omg, I've entered the halls of hipster hell.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
macbeth remember that professor i told you about? he claimed that the ban on soda, excessive tax of cigarettes and strict regulations of handguns in nyc would give way to stalin/hitler/mussolini dictatorial type states.
tyranny!!!1
tyranny!!!1
is the green agenda 'hipster' in america or something? the 'green' agenda here is pushed by septuagenarians and people with the wrong sort of facial hair. their anoraks were bought in 1970 but they most definitely are not 'vintage'. nice to see the H-word come up again on this board, though. it really is becoming a marker of intelligent discourse.Jay wrote:
Omg, I've entered the halls of hipster hell.
Are you just stupid because you are young, or is it your Brooklyn upbringing that was your undoing? You make Macbeth look brilliant by comparison, no small feat.13/f/taiwan wrote:
macbeth remember that professor i told you about? he claimed that the ban on soda, excessive tax of cigarettes and strict regulations of handguns in nyc would give way to stalin/hitler/mussolini dictatorial type states.
tyranny!!!1
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
hey jay what's the poor part of town in NYC you grew up in?
What professor? I don't remember.
I told you, hipster is a synonym for young, stupid, liberal, and trend following.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
is the green agenda 'hipster' in america or something? the 'green' agenda here is pushed by septuagenarians and people with the wrong sort of facial hair. their anoraks were bought in 1970 but they most definitely are not 'vintage'. nice to see the H-word come up again on this board, though. it really is becoming a marker of intelligent discourse.Jay wrote:
Omg, I've entered the halls of hipster hell.
OMG I WATCHED THIS TED TALK AND THIS REALLY SMART GUY HAD ALL THESE IDEAS FOR SAVING THE WORLD!!!!!!!!!!
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glen_Cove,_NYUzique The Lesser wrote:
hey jay what's the poor part of town in NYC you grew up in?
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
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