BF2S Forums Race relations thread

uziq wrote:

maybe if police forces spent as much on introductory judo training as they do on high-tech armaments and military hand-me-downs, the policing picture would look a little different in america. instead people get shot when their tail-lights are out. police are taught to 'dominate' a situation and be assertive, which, especially in the case of black people, quickly escalates the the situation and increases tension.

the guy was heavily inebriated. he was drunk, not on PCP. how formidable are dead drunk people in fights?

Jay wrote:

uziq wrote:

my point is that violent convicted felon or no, that shouldn't have any bearing on whether or not the police can shoot him. we don't live in a society where sheriffs hunt down criminals and bag-n-tag them.

and i do happen to know that, with pretty rudimentary grappling training, you can learn to effectively take down pretty much anyone. there were two of them and they outsized the guy. it's not difficult to immobilize and detain someone, no. especially with two people on one.

You've clearly never been in a fight.

Jay wrote:

uziq wrote:

maybe if police forces spent as much on introductory judo training as they do on high-tech armaments and military hand-me-downs, the policing picture would look a little different in america. instead people get shot when their tail-lights are out. police are taught to 'dominate' a situation and be assertive, which, especially in the case of black people, quickly escalates the the situation and increases tension.

the guy was heavily inebriated. he was drunk, not on PCP. how formidable are dead drunk people in fights?

you just criticized the cops for losing control and now you're criticizing them for trying to dominate? Pick one.

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

OJ Simpson was suspected of murder and had that slow-speed chase. Did the police snipe him from a helicopter?

Dilbert_X wrote:

I'm sure you're a great expert on hand-to-hand combat. Have you tried it? I have. Its not like chess.

The point is he was a violent convicted felon, not your average dad who dozed off waiting for a burger.

He was running away. With a taser. The police decided to go all Judge Dredd. But sure, divert focus.

Jay, the Daniel Shaver execution didn't just disappear.

October 2019,

Mesa Cop Calls People 'Idiots' for Bringing Up Shaver Shooting on Facebook
https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/da … n-11374239

But some thin-skinned officers are more than ready to forget what happened. After another Facebook commenter chimed in, a Mesa cop used her personal account to call commenters "idiots" on the department's Facebook page.

Someone said the original commenter "seems to have a 100% problem with police" and that most cops aren't bad. That's when Karrie Flanigan, a 20-year veteran with the Mesa Police Department, published a comment saying that the second comment "just makes too much sense for some of these idiots that post and have nothing else to complain about."

The Mesa Police Department itself briefly "liked" Flanigan's comment calling people bringing up Shaver's shooting "idiots," but Flanigan's comment has since been deleted. A Twitter account dedicated to calling out instances of alleged police misconduct, Mesa Police Accountability, took a screenshot of the post.

Asked why the Mesa Police Department liked the post, Detective Nik Rasheta, a department spokesperson, told Phoenix New Times it was an accident.

"Basically, our social media is kinda overviewed by a few different individuals, including PIOs [Public Information Officers] and backup PIOs," Rasheta said. "All of us have a personal Facebook account linked so we can be an administrator" for the Mesa Police Department page. "We toggle back and forth between those. This particular PIO was scrolling through and liking things to make sure there was some interaction on the post. He saw Karrie's name, recognized her, and inadvertently clicked "like" when he saw just the good part at the end of the post." The PIO did later un-like the post, Rasheta said.

The shooting of Daniel Shaver brought national scrutiny to the Mesa Police Department: The Department of Justice is still investigating Shaver's death, and Shaver's family filed a $75 million lawsuit over Brailsford's actions.

Yes, the the article gets some of the details wrong (the sergeant was the one giving orders, not shooter Brailsford). I don't think this destracts from its point.

I've seen his name mentioned constantly since his death in discussions related to police brutality in the US. The video was powerful and difficult to watch.

#BLM Activists Call Attention To Graphic Video Of Daniel Shaver's Death At The Hands Of Arizona Police
https://blavity.com/blm-activists-call- … e-identity

Here's another man who was killed a year before:

Mesa Settles With Family of 2015 Police Shooting Victim for $1 Million
https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/me … o-10767156

The previously unreported payments conclude the legal aftermath of a police shooting that received significant local media attention. The settlements were made in a year when the Mesa Police Department has come under increased scrutiny for its use of force, leading to two federal investigations of three incidents.

Dilbert_X wrote:

So when you were arrested did you try to take down the cops and grab their weapons?

Have you ever tried to subdue someone?

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

You have no idea how drunk he was, have the toxicology reports come back?
He seemed pretty adept at hand-to-hand combat, grabbing tasers and sprinting for someone who was paralytic.

the video clearly says that he was asleep and slurring his speech when they arrived. he was drunk.

But in the video he was able to take down two cops, grab and operate their weapons and sprint - hardly the behaviour of your average drunk.

uziq wrote:

'why weren't they properly physically trained?'

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

So here we are. Thread can now be about how much each new person "deserved" to die (nevermind likely sentencing they'd otherwise get). Not how much the police need different tools and skills.

Last edited by uziq (2020-06-16 07:27:29)

uziq wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

So here we are. Thread can now be about how much each new person "deserved" to die (nevermind likely sentencing they'd otherwise get). Not how much the police need different tools and skills.

dilbert has the most impoverished spirit of any human being i have ever encountered. there is such an impoverishment of his imagination and human sympathy.

he is outraged at the police as an institution when he recalls his own family’s mistreatment. full of lists of police over-action, abuse of power, official negligence and cover up. he states that the police need to be started over with, stop being paramilitary, etc.

next week a black guy ends up dead and one fast food franchise gets burned down. he is a law and order man. what do you expect, punk?

he has all the answers from his obviously superlative and vast store of experiences. and they all confirm ... dilbert as right! incredible.

a race war is coming etc etc

Larssen wrote:

The principal problem with US police lies in the focus on domination rather than deescalation. Battlefield dominance is a military objective, not the modus operandi for establishing security in a civilian society. You don't relentlessly shout at and shoot people. Take a cue from policing in northern europe and scandinavia please.

Last edited by Jay (2020-06-16 07:33:35)