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2006-08-18 08:24:18
Spumantiii
pistolero
+147|6941|Canada

Major_Spittle wrote:

the_hitman_kills wrote:

Major_Spittle wrote:

ummm, the Mooslims groups fighting Israel are driven by their religion to destroy Israel and NonMooslims.  This is a fact, they openly admit it, Maybe you should. 

This is why CameronPoe will always look like an Idiot no matter what he says about how Israel is to blame for everything.  Jews get along with all religions/groups of people in the world, Mooslims war with all religions/groups of people in the world they come into contact with.  These are FACTS, that everyone knows.  Only racism could allow someone to overlook these FACTS.

Cameron, why aren't the Christians in Israel/Palestine fighting the Jews/Israel???
you have to remember, there are hundreds of millions of Muslims around the entire world, it is one of the largest religions in the world.

with so many people, all of different cultures and backgrounds, there's bound to be some misunderstanding and people stepping on each other toes.

you cant say all Muslims are bad, just like you cant say all Israelis are bad people.
"the Mooslims groups fighting Israel are driven by their religion to destroy Israel and NonMooslims.  This is a fact, they openly admit it, Maybe you should."

Yes, while the radical groups may not represent all Muslims, I have yet to see as many radical hate groups born out of Hinduism, Buddhism, Judaism, or Christianity.  Most Muslim nations are warring with their neighbors.  Anyone who looks objectively at all religions would conclude that Islam is by far the most repressive and militant religion of all the major religions. 

Yes, it is a generalization.  But the context of the argument is Israel vs the organizations it is at war with.  I would never individually condemn someone only based upon religion.  Unlike Cameron with the Jews.
a real stand up guy, who quotes himself


duuuuuh spittle what about Catholic/Protestants? What about thecrusades?  What about the Spanish Inquisition?  Are you DEVOID of knowledge?
What about all the 'witches'  burnt at the stake?
What about burning black churches?


Bubbalo wrote:

Let's look at how that logic goes:

1)  Rockets are being fired at us!  Quick, build a buffer zone!

2)  Let's all live in the buffer zone!

3)  Rockets are being fired at us!  Quick, build a buffer zone!

4)  Let's all live in the buffer zone!

And so on and so forth.
https://www.harpers.org/art/cartoons/mrfish/Tshirt_350.jpg

Last edited by Spumantiii (2006-08-18 08:55:15)

2006-08-18 08:26:07
smtt686
this is the best we can do?
+95|6889|USA

Lisik wrote:

all what Israel have done u can see on tv...
does that include the doctored photos???
2006-08-18 12:31:03
Spumantiii
pistolero
+147|6941|Canada
There is no doubt that Saturday’s suicide bombing constituted a brutal and unconscionable act of terrorism. But those who are genuinely concerned with the promotion of human rights, justice and peace, those who truly want an end to terrorism, cannot be selective about whose terrorism they condemn. Although the Israeli spokesmen ranted and raved about how their country continues to be a hapless victim of Palestinian terrorism, no mention was made of the ongoing reality of routine Israeli terrorism against Palestinians, day-in and day-out in the Occupied Territories. When 8 Israelis are killed and another 170 injured, the international community is appalled. But when dozens of Palestinians are killed and hundreds more injured, the international community is indifferent. Terrorism by our clients, unfortunately, hardly ever makes the news.
http://www.mediamonitors.net/mosaddeq22.html

The Diary of former Israeli Prime Minister Moshe Sharett is a major source of evidence for a conscious policy of deliberate, unprovoked cross-border attacks, in which advantage was taken of superior military power and a servile western propaganda machine, with the intent of destabilizing neighboring states and provoking them into military responses. Sharett was a footdragger in these enterprises, often shaken by the ruthlessness of the military establishment-"the long chain of false incidents and hostilities we have invented, and so many clashes we have provoked;" the "narrow-mindedness and short-sightedness of our military leaders" [who] "seem to presume that the State of Israel may-or even must-behave in the realm of international relations according to the laws of the jungle." Sharett himself referred to this long effort as a "sacred terrorism."
Where Israeli state terrorism is acknowledged in the United States, it is almost invariably described as "retaliatory," hence not criminal even if regrettable.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Herma … erman.html


Close ties

Mr Erdogan stressed that Turks had once "opened their hearts and homes" to Jews who fled from the Inquisition and now they wanted to mediate between Israel and other countries in the Middle East to achieve peace.


Erdogan leads an Islamic-rooted party in Turkey's secular system
But he stood by his earlier accusation that Israel was practising "state terrorism" against Palestinians.

"When you look at the structure of what has happened, how else can you interpret it?" he said.

Israel usually enjoys very close relations with Turkey, its strongest military and trade partner in the Middle East region.

Mr Erdogan went on to make an apparently veiled criticism of another ally, Washington, calling for a more multilateral approach in its "global war on terrorism".

"Saying 'I am the strong one, so I can name anyone I want as a terrorist and anyone I want as a criminal and just kill them and go' - that mentality is wrong," he said.

"All those responsible are losing their credibility with every passing day... You must have followed what kind of reactions the pictures of the abuse in Abu Ghraib prison [in Iraq] received," he added.

The interview ends with Mr Erdogan sending "shalom" to all the citizens of Israel, especially the ones who emigrated from Turkey.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3772609.stm

Last edited by Spumantiii (2006-08-18 12:33:53)

2006-08-20 09:11:42
Sh1fty2k5
MacSwedish
+113|6968|Sweden
Lisik, you're such a brainwashed motherfucker. The world would have been so peaceful if Hitler actually suceeded with killing all the jews.
2006-08-20 09:18:47
_PQWeR_AuRoRa_olly
Member
+22|6768|Surrey, United Kingdom
you people have too much time on your hands.
2006-08-20 09:25:49
HM1{N}
Member
+86|6902|East Coast via Los Angeles, CA

cyborg_ninja-117 wrote:

Both countries have done terrible things yes, but 2 wrongs doesnt make a right does it? so israel attacks palestine coz theyre in fear palestine will attack, so it goes back and forth. what happened between the peace between the 2 countries last year? didnt palestine and israel call a truce and i quote areil sharon said nothing will break the peace between palestein and israel, then some dumbfuck terrorist has to fuck it up
Yeah, that terrorist was an Israeli gunship that shelled innocent Palestinians on a beach while on holiday...

Last edited by HM1{N} (2006-08-20 09:26:09)

2006-08-20 09:40:50
Flecco
iPod is broken.
+1,048|6923|NT, like Mick Dundee

Sh1fty2k5 wrote:

Lisik, you're such a brainwashed motherfucker. The world would have been so peaceful if Hitler actually suceeded with killing all the jews.
No it wouldn't. Trust me on this. People fight people.

HM1, I do believe it was a stray artillery round that was fired into the wrong area of the Gaza Strip.
Whoa... Can't believe these forums are still kicking.
2006-08-20 09:43:23
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|6902

HM1{N} wrote:

cyborg_ninja-117 wrote:

Both countries have done terrible things yes, but 2 wrongs doesnt make a right does it? so israel attacks palestine coz theyre in fear palestine will attack, so it goes back and forth. what happened between the peace between the 2 countries last year? didnt palestine and israel call a truce and i quote areil sharon said nothing will break the peace between palestein and israel, then some dumbfuck terrorist has to fuck it up
Yeah, that terrorist was an Israeli gunship that shelled innocent Palestinians on a beach while on holiday...
I thought it was the terrorists that decided to cross the line and kidnap a uniformed soldiern or am i mistaken?
2006-08-20 09:49:53
the_hitman_kills
Agent 47 wannabe
+32|6723|Inside my APC

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

HM1{N} wrote:

cyborg_ninja-117 wrote:

Both countries have done terrible things yes, but 2 wrongs doesn't make a right does it? so israel attacks palestine coz theyre in fear palestine will attack, so it goes back and forth. what happened between the peace between the 2 countries last year? didnt palestine and israel call a truce and i quote areil sharon said nothing will break the peace between palestein and israel, then some dumbfuck terrorist has to fuck it up
Yeah, that terrorist was an Israeli gunship that shelled innocent Palestinians on a beach while on holiday...
I thought it was the terrorists that decided to cross the line and kidnap a uniformed soldiern or am i mistaken?
the kidnapping was last month (Hez grabbed 2 IDF) and the shelling was last year (Israel gunship killed a Palestine family relaxing on a beach).

edit
sry, the beach incident wasn't last year it was in june 2006:
From the BBC
The deaths on 9 June drew international condemnation. Militant group Hamas cancelled its informal truce.

Last edited by the_hitman_kills (2006-08-20 09:59:54)

2006-08-20 10:04:05
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|6902

the_hitman_kills wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

HM1{N} wrote:


Yeah, that terrorist was an Israeli gunship that shelled innocent Palestinians on a beach while on holiday...
I thought it was the terrorists that decided to cross the line and kidnap a uniformed soldiern or am i mistaken?
the kidnapping was last month (Hez grabbed 2 IDF) and the shelling was last year (Israel gunship killed a Palestine family relaxing on a beach).

edit
sry, the beach incident wasn't last year it was in june 2006:
From the BBC
The deaths on 9 June drew international condemnation. Militant group Hamas cancelled its informal truce.
im not talking about hezbollah, im talking about what hamas did to warrant the israeli shelling. they were the first to kidnap an IDF soldier
2006-08-20 10:11:26
Kibbick
Member
+1|6891
I don't feel any sympathy towards the people of lebanon or palestine. You support attacks to kill civilians in another country for decades, now you complain that the other side has had enough and his hitting back just as indescriminatly? Tough shit, shoulda thought that through before you supported killing innocents.
2006-08-20 10:19:26
the_hitman_kills
Agent 47 wannabe
+32|6723|Inside my APC
i didn't think there was a ceasefire in place after the beach incident. (i could be wrong, the situation seems to change alot)

the IDF did bomb the Gaza strip after a IDF soldier got kidnapped, this was after they ended the occupation Gaza and removed their troops.
2006-08-20 10:24:44
the_hitman_kills
Agent 47 wannabe
+32|6723|Inside my APC

Kibbick wrote:

I don't feel any sympathy towards the people of lebanon or palestine. You support attacks to kill civilians in another country for decades, now you complain that the other side has had enough and his hitting back just as indescriminatly? Tough shit, shoulda thought that through before you supported killing innocents.
i don't support terrorists, i think they are the scum of the earth.

Israel is meant to be a modern enlightened country, when they starting killing indescriminatly should it be ignored?

I don't like my neighbors, if Israel is aloud to kill innocent people, then maybe i am aloud to kill my neighbors. But i won't because i am better then that, i wont lower myself to their level.
2006-08-20 11:01:41
jonsimon
Member
+224|6753

the_hitman_kills wrote:

Kibbick wrote:

I don't feel any sympathy towards the people of lebanon or palestine. You support attacks to kill civilians in another country for decades, now you complain that the other side has had enough and his hitting back just as indescriminatly? Tough shit, shoulda thought that through before you supported killing innocents.
i don't support terrorists, i think they are the scum of the earth.

Israel is meant to be a modern enlightened country, when they starting killing indescriminatly should it be ignored?

I don't like my neighbors, if Israel is aloud to kill innocent people, then maybe i am aloud to kill my neighbors. But i won't because i am better then that, i wont lower myself to their level.
I like your style. I'd +1 you if I hadn't already today.

Last edited by jonsimon (2006-08-20 11:01:58)

2006-08-20 12:37:27
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6840|SE London

the_hitman_kills wrote:

Kibbick wrote:

I don't feel any sympathy towards the people of lebanon or palestine. You support attacks to kill civilians in another country for decades, now you complain that the other side has had enough and his hitting back just as indescriminatly? Tough shit, shoulda thought that through before you supported killing innocents.
i don't support terrorists, i think they are the scum of the earth.

Israel is meant to be a modern enlightened country, when they starting killing indescriminatly should it be ignored?

I don't like my neighbors, if Israel is aloud to kill innocent people, then maybe i am aloud to kill my neighbors. But i won't because i am better then that, i wont lower myself to their level.
Israel have been indescriminantly killing civilians and commiting acts of terrorism since even before they were a state.


The article this thread is about sounds like a crock of shit to me. Not very professionally done - they've called the PLO the PLA at one point in the article, how many other facts have they got massively wrong - the People's Liberation Army of China have nothing to do with Israel or Palestine.
2006-08-20 19:44:37
rawls2
Mr. Bigglesworth
+89|6818

Spumantiii wrote:

rawls2 wrote:

When Israel no longer has borders or the state ceases to exist and they still occupy the land then I'll consider them terrorist. But as for now, they are defending their HOME, yes, THEIR HOME.
read a book.  They are not defending, they are offending and occupying land
Last time I saw an Atlas the land was clearly labeled ISRAEL.

Last edited by rawls2 (2006-08-20 19:44:56)

2006-08-21 01:44:35
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6814

rawls2 wrote:

Spumantiii wrote:

rawls2 wrote:

When Israel no longer has borders or the state ceases to exist and they still occupy the land then I'll consider them terrorist. But as for now, they are defending their HOME, yes, THEIR HOME.
read a book.  They are not defending, they are offending and occupying land
Last time I saw an Atlas the land was clearly labeled ISRAEL.
Israeli borders don't extend into the West Bank, Golan Heights, Shebaa Farms or East Jerusalem in any of the international atlases I've seen. Perhaps that's because they are ILLEGALLY OCCUPYING them. You can start calling them terrorists now if you want.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-08-21 02:01:07)

2006-08-21 01:59:01
Pernicious544
Zee Tank Skank
+80|6959|MoVal So-Cal
Does anyone here watch "The Muppets?" Man, Kermit is awsome...
2006-08-21 02:23:53
choongy
Member
+4|6738|SYDNEY AUSTRALIA

Flecco wrote:

Ikarti wrote:

Lisik's a dumb Israeli kid who has been brainwashed by the propaganda spewed over there. I kinda pity him.
He might not be dumb, he is probably not brainwashed. He is just..

a) Biased due to country of residence.
b) Never been taught better.

Hey, Lisik, we know some Palestinians have done bad things so lets ask you a hypothetical question.

Somebody breaks your leg in a car accident, does that give you the right to kill them, their family and that random person you saw walking down the street who looks a little like them?

Collective punishment is a dreadful idea.

EDIT

Added the word "some". Because the militants within Palestine are in the minority.
true, but how can israel  defend themselves from this palestinian minority? (genuine question)
2006-08-21 02:32:30
Flecco
iPod is broken.
+1,048|6923|NT, like Mick Dundee

They could follow the Nazi route and try ethnic cleansing. They could actually give them the territories that they were promised in that UN resolution all those years ago. They could stop building settlements in the buffer zones.
Whoa... Can't believe these forums are still kicking.
2006-08-21 02:33:22
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6814

choongy wrote:

Flecco wrote:

Ikarti wrote:

Lisik's a dumb Israeli kid who has been brainwashed by the propaganda spewed over there. I kinda pity him.
He might not be dumb, he is probably not brainwashed. He is just..

a) Biased due to country of residence.
b) Never been taught better.

Hey, Lisik, we know some Palestinians have done bad things so lets ask you a hypothetical question.

Somebody breaks your leg in a car accident, does that give you the right to kill them, their family and that random person you saw walking down the street who looks a little like them?

Collective punishment is a dreadful idea.

EDIT

Added the word "some". Because the militants within Palestine are in the minority.
true, but how can israel  defend themselves from this palestinian minority? (genuine question)
They can withdraw from East Jerusalem and the West Bank, dismantle all settlements, pay reparations to the Palestinian refugees spread all across the middle east and allow Palestine to become a fully sovereign nation with control over its seas, airspace and borders. That would be a far more effective 'defence' than mindlessly killing civilians in collective punishment exercises.
2006-08-21 02:35:06
choongy
Member
+4|6738|SYDNEY AUSTRALIA

CameronPoe wrote:

Thanks to iNeedUrFace4Soup for the text from the website.

OK where do we begin. We can all acknowledge that a deplorable massacre of innocents occurred at Damour. That is irrefutable fact. The forces of the PLO were responsible that is also true. But let us analyse certain facts about this account of the massacre:

1) The website hosting this account is www.falangist.com. Christian Falangism is a fascist movement originating in Spain. The Christian Falange paramilitary organisation in Lebanon were one of the main protagonists of the Lebanese civil war. They espoused hard-right principles and were responsible for deplorable behaviour on a par with or worse than that which occurred at Damour at the hands of the PLO. This does not make the PLO's behaviour any more acceptable but I think we should all understand the nature of the website hosting this account. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that, aided and abetted by the odious Ariel Sharon, the Falangists were repsonsible for the appalling Sabra & Shatila Massacre, where upwards of 800 Palestinian civilians were killed. As such, they are no angels by any manner of means. Just to put things in context.

2) Further Context: The Karantina Massacre occurred on 18th of January 1976. Karantina was overrun by Christian militias with Syrian backing, and a large number of civilians massacred. This precedes the Damour massacre and many put this forward this as the reason behind the harshness of the PLO's response (over 1000 civilians were killed at Karantina).

3) This account is written extremely emotively and is designed to pull at the readers' heart strings, especially those of the christian faith (a faith I have long abandoned). Let's look at some examples: the account is frequently embellished with needless emotive comments like 'even the orange trees were stripped of their fruit in the citrus groves' and 'except one old man who said he could not walk and would prefer to die in front of his own house'. It states that the massacre occurred 'three days after Epiphany' - big deal! OMG it was 3 days after Epiphany!! I'm sure the muslims were aware of the Epiphany and when it occurred! LOL. The fact of the matter is that this account is overly sentimental and is not a statement of hard facts in the traditional sense. It plays out the incident like some sort of soap opera. I don't want to disparage the poor innocent victims of this gruesome massacre but if you're gonna post a 'respectable' account of the massacre to the general populace please post something more purely factual and post something from a respectable source.

4) Civil wars are never pretty. Most countries in the world have had theirs and I'm sure similar (-ish at least) deplorable acts were perpetrated by either protagonist in your own particular country's fight for liberation.

5) To borrow a christian phrase "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone". Israel are far from angels, in fact they have acted as deplorably as some of these falangist, islamist and 'terrorist' factions have done in the past. The only reason they seem to be exempt from criticism is their clever manipulation of world opinion/the press and the fact that they are an official state. When one uses a conventional army to do the work of a 'terrorist', masquerading under the banners of self-defence or pre-emptive threat prevention, it is harder for the layperson to view them as 'terrorists' in the ordinary sense. The fact of the matter is however that Israel is a terrorist state as bad as any of these evil little factions we speak of here. It is in fact a state born out of the 'terrorism' of the Haganah, Lehi and Irgun and out of the displacement of millions of peoples from their homes. Read up on it.
"a faith i have long abandoned"? wouldn't that make you SLIGHTLY biased against Christians, which kinda destroys any objective comments on the faith? And Israel exempt from criticism? Haven't you seen the news or read this very thread? Israel's getting criticism by the truckload.
2006-08-21 02:49:49
choongy
Member
+4|6738|SYDNEY AUSTRALIA

Major_Spittle wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Major_Spittle wrote:

ummm, the Mooslims groups fighting Israel are driven by their religion to destroy Israel and NonMooslims.  This is a fact, they openly admit it, Maybe you should. 

This is why CameronPoe will always look like an Idiot no matter what he says about how Israel is to blame for everything.  Jews get along with all religions/groups of people in the world, Mooslims war with all religions/groups of people in the world they come into contact with.  These are FACTS, that everyone knows.  Only racism could allow someone to overlook these FACTS.

Cameron, why aren't the Christians in Israel/Palestine fighting the Jews/Israel???
"Jews get along with all religions/groups"

OK let's analyse this:

* Jews in general have a deep-seated hatred for Muslims.
* Jews did not seem to integrate very well into Europe, the ultimate result being the deplorable acts of Adolf Hitler, Nazi Germany and the likes of Austria, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia. This disgusting act was the culmination of centuries of purges of Jews throughout Europe which occurred periodically throughout European history. So you could say that they didn't exactly get along like a house on fire with Europeans.
* Palestinians hate Israelis because they dispossessed hundreds of thousands of them, by force, from their homesteads and farmlands to become perpetual refugees. They since proceeded to make Palestinians lives more and more miserable ever since. Hardly endearing qualities.
* Muslims tend to hate Israel partly through indoctrination (through things like the popularity of 'The Chronicles of the Elders of Zion'), partly because Israel's stolen state annexes the third holiest shrine in Islam and also because of the crimes Israel have committed against their Arab brethren in Palestine. A minority of extreme militants are religious ideologues who wish to rid the middle east of all non-muslims. Check up the Hamas charter on Wikipedia - one article specifically states that the state they want in that region be one of tolerance towards people of any/all creeds.
* There are plenty of Christian Palestinians fighting the Israelis. Not just Palestinians but Arabs from other countries too - Iraq's foreign minister Tariq Aziz was a Catholic for instance.

I don't know whether I should have responded or not - nearly every post you make is sarcastic.
So your response is:

1. Jews hate Muslims...... 
(my reply)just because??? tell me why. does their religion preach hate??? You are just a Moron.

2. Jews brought on the Holocoust themselves......
(my reply)you are a moron. Are you saying the Blacks didn't integrate well either.  Only your Arian race should have been in Europe huh.  You're a moron.

3. Palestinians hate Jews..... 
(my reply)No shit. I said the Mooslims fighting Israel hate Jews and those groups hate all nonMuslims.

4. Muslims hate Jews.....   
(my reply)No shit. I said the Mooslims fighting Israel hate Jews and those groups hate all nonMuslims.

5. There are plenty of Christian Palestinians fighting the Israelis. Not just Palestinians but Arabs from other countries too - Iraq's foreign minister Tariq Aziz was a Catholic for instance.....   
(my reply)LOL, Tariq Aziz.  You are a fucking idiot.  Yep, just yesterday I read where the Christian terrorist groups started sending retarded 13 year olds into Israeli stores to blow themselves up.   You're not the sharpest tool in the shed.
haha +1 for making my day
2006-08-21 02:55:02
choongy
Member
+4|6738|SYDNEY AUSTRALIA

CameronPoe wrote:

Major_Spittle wrote:

Yes, it is a generalization.  But the context of the argument is Israel vs the organizations it is at war with.  I would never individually condemn someone only based upon religion.  Unlike Cameron with the Jews.
Au contraire Spittle I absolutely positively love Jews like this:

http://www.jewsagainstzionism.com/

And secular Jews who aren't into settling the West Bank & East Jerusalem.
secular Jews?
2006-08-21 03:03:57
Lisik
Member
+74|6759|Israel

Sh1fty2k5 wrote:

Lisik, you're such a brainwashed motherfucker. The world would have been so peaceful if Hitler actually suceeded with killing all the jews.
uuummm intresting! so u say that all suicide attacks on israel was made by israeli goverment? all wars against israel was planned by jews? or maybe its idf who kiddnaped soldiers and shoting katushas on me?

can u explain please were exactly i was brainwashed?

oh and btw i had bad news for u... even Heinrich Luitpold Himmler noticet that it is imposible to kill all jews, becouse it is imposible to kill Richard Strauss!

PS: i think peoples who killed European culture its peoples like u Sh1fty2k5!!! peoples with low id, full by hate!!!

 

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