BF2S Forums For those who believe that the war in Iraq is going badly.

Hey, if CNN wasn't part of the liberal conspiracy, they would have omitted the "alleged" in the headline. 

If genuine, though, it is interesting.  Especially this part:

Al-Zarqawi allegedly wrote:

The question remains, how to draw the Americans into fighting a war against Iran?

It is not known whether American is serious in its animosity towards Iraq, because of the big support Iran is offering to America in its war in Afghanistan and in Iraq.

Hence, it is necessary first to exaggerate the Iranian danger and to convince America and the west in general, of the real danger coming from Iran, and this would be done by the following:

   1. By disseminating threatening messages against American interests and the American people and attribute them to a Shiite Iranian side.
   2. By executing operations of kidnapping hostages and implicating the Shiite Iranian side.
   3. By advertising that Iran has chemical and nuclear weapons and is threatening the west with these weapons.
   4. By executing exploding operations in the west and accusing Iran by planting Iranian Shiite fingerprints and evidence.
   5. By declaring the existence of a relationship between Iran and terrorist groups (as termed by the Americans).
   6. By disseminating bogus messages about confessions showing that Iran is in possession of weapons of mass destruction or that there are attempts by the Iranian intelligence to undertake terrorist operations in America and the west and against western interests.

I thought this thread was going to go the other way... so I don't need to argue. 

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

People claim CNN is a liberal news site, but why would they post this if they were?

Because CNN is owned by the biggest commie loving, american hating, SOB that's donated way too much time to the UN aka the United - communist - Nations.  Fox news is a little better, but I never trust more than half of what I hear from anyone that thinks average citizens should not own guns.
How can anyone ever bitch over starving africans, parentless children in china, and living conditions in India in one breath and say we should leave Iraq alone????
We all sit over here in our air conditioned houses, cry about our taxes, scream at god wondering where the police are when some jerk kid cuts us off on the freeway and SERIOUSLY have NO IDEA what it's like in Iraq today, let alone what it was like under Sadam.
I wonder what Iraq would be like today had the muslims not run out, burn out, and kill most the christians 50 years ago.  I don't understand why so few people get it!

here's a good video featuring 3 refomed terrorists:

http://tinyurl.com/dl2dm

How well do we trust the Iraqi National Security Advisor?  What's the likelihood that this document was actually found in al-Zarqawi's hideout, and not forged?  Not trying to pass the document off as a forgery, but I'm skeptical by nature.

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

People claim CNN is a liberal news site, but why would they post this if they were?

If it is authentic, what would CNN gain by not publishing it?  Even if they are liberal, that doesn't make them less American.  That it would, is a misconception that seems to be gaining popularity and must be corrected.

CNN would be stupid not to publish such an artifact, regardless of their political stance.  They're probably popping champagne corks in celebration of this web traffic boost.  And of the realization that victory in this much-contested conflict is not impossible.

Now, the possibility that it's a fabrication brings up so many other questions.  But that's just my skepticism talking.

Last edited by antin0de (2006-06-15 14:20:33)

Darth_Fleder wrote:

As you all well know, there is a very vocal element here in the forums that believe that the war in Iraq is going badly and that defeating the insurgency there is well nigh impossible. However, that was not the opinion of the former insurgent leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. Here in a translation of a document penned by al-Zarqawi and captured after his carefully arranged meeting with Allah, he writes of the growing desperation of the insurgency's cause...

al-Zarqawi wrote:

...However, here in Iraq, time is now beginning to be of service to the American forces and harmful to the resistance for the following reasons:

1.  By allowing the American forces to form the forces of the National Guard, to reinforce them and enable them to undertake military operations against the resistance.
2.  By undertaking massive arrest operations, invading regions that have an impact on the resistance, and hence causing the resistance to lose many of its elements.
3.  By undertaking a media campaign against the resistance resulting in weakening its influence inside the country and presenting its work as harmful to the population rather than being beneficial to the population.
4.  By tightening the resistance's financial outlets, restricting its moral options and by confiscating its ammunition and weapons.
5.  By creating a big division among the ranks of the resistance and jeopardizing its attack operations, it has weakened its influence and internal support of its elements, thus resulting in a decline of the resistance's assaults.
6.  By allowing an increase in the number of countries and elements supporting the occupation or at least allowing to become neutral in their stand toward us in contrast to their previous stand or refusal of the occupation.
7.  By taking advantage of the resistance's mistakes and magnifying them in order to misinform.

...In general and despite the current bleak situation, we think that the best suggestions in order to get out of this crisis is to entangle the American forces into another war against another country or with another of our enemy force, that is to try and inflame the situation between American and Iraq or between America and the Shiites in general....

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast … cument.ap/

I think that al-Zarqawi was in a better postion to guage the effects that Coalition forces were having on his cause than many in the mainstream media and some on these forums. However as this does not fit in with many political agendas, I expect this to be rather downplayed.

Discuss.

I would appreciate it if the conversation did not devolve into page after page of name calling as has heppened in some other topics in recent past.

THis article is interesting and I'd like to propose a theory. CNN has a liberal bias apparently. I don't refer to it much so I'm not aware if they're as bad as Fox News is for being the opposite, i.e. neo-conservative, but maybe CNN have an agenda here. The US media (and obviously those who control it) sold the idea of a war in Iraq by bombarding the citizens with scaremongering and stories of WMDs and various other threats - so that the goverment would have some popular support for their acts.
This CNN story makes repeated direct suggestions that Zarqawi was attempting to have the US declare war on Iran by fooling them into thinking Iranians are involved in the insurgency. By printing the story this will cast doubt in the minds of US citizens as to whether Iran is such a threat to the US at all, in terms of Iraq anyway, seing as elements opposed to the US are trying to finger the Iranians for things they didn't do. This also makes it easier to scoff at US government assertions that Iran is involved in fuelling the insurgency (a nice justification/pretext for waron Iran). CNN could be countering the media hype and buildup surrounding the 'crisis with Iran', which to me is just another media-created wave of fear designed to give the US government the necessary popular support to attack Iran, in order to turn public opinion against any kind of military action in Iran.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-06-15 14:26:52)

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

EDIT:  This just in! You can be a communist and a good American at the same time!

No you can't.
I do believe you can be a "former communist" and currently a good american.  I guess one would have to define a good American first...
Good American's believe in their personal freedom - communism... no
I could go on, but really why... either you get it or you don't.

History has proven 1 great thing about communism.  It only works great in 1 place.  The insect world, i.e. ants, bees, etc.

I would have to see the entire thing, and I wonder if its The real thing or some propaganda attempt. But as wars go this one isn't doing well for the insurgents.

Did anyone else notice how eloquently written it was.  Doesn't sound like a raving mad-man to me.  If it was fabricated, you would think that they would make it sound more like a rant, to fit the media described character.  It looks to me like a well thought-out plan of action for the insurgents.  I'm not sure if it really supports the authenticity or not, but I thought it a little odd.

If anyone cares, here is a link to stats compiled on the Iraq War, from '03 to now. Trends in the numbers can provide this so called "evidence" everyone claims to have. If you want to know whether or not the Iraq War is going badly, goodly or whatever, check it out. I urge you to compare electrical production over the 3 years we've been there, along with potable water, sewage access,...etc. Do historical comparisons on similar times of year and numbers within that time between the 3 years. Honestly there are pretty positive, as well as some pretty negative, arguments that could be derived from the data. These are simple, honest numbers. Oh, and it's in a PDF.

http://www.brookings.edu/fp/saban/iraq/index.htm

Scotch

Sorry, I dont get it...the headline of this topic says something about the WAR in Iraq,
didnt the holy leader of the USA told the world the war in Iraq is over and that the USA won...(LOL)

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

EDIT:  This just in! You can be a communist and a good American at the same time!

Troll much?

This is wishful thinking on some liberals' part. I (and a great many others) consider communism an anathema to American values. The cold war is ever forgotten...

Jeopardia_Ferdy wrote:

Sorry, I dont get it...the headline of this topic says something about the WAR in Iraq,
didnt the holy leader of the USA told the world the war in Iraq is over and that the USA won...(LOL)

Wow, you get US news in your Kangaroo country.  We don't get your news here, how strange.  Sucks being a nobody in a nobody country that your afraid to even claim.

herrr_smity wrote:

Major_Spittle wrote:

The only good commie is a dead commie.

the only good capitalist is a dead capitalist
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/511/che3bh.jpg

More dead commies in history than Capitalist.  Also more wealthy Capitalist than commies.  In fact, it must really suck to be a commie.  Even commie women are ugly.  Why don't you go back to f*ckin' fish up there in Norway you wanna be commie fag.