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Poll

Should flag burning be illegal?

yes32%32% - 43
no31%31% - 42
fuck no36%36% - 49
Total: 134
2006-05-29 05:35:49
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA
Ok let me try this one........you say a flag is piece of fabric an inanimate object..desecrating it doesn't harm anyone.

A dead body is an inanimate object, no soul, just dead meat, yet there are laws forbidding the desecration of it. WHY??... Out of respect.  Same with tombstones, it is illegal to desecrate a cemetery. Why?? Out of respect, but by your logic it is just a bunch of stones.

The same applies to our flag, out of respect, it should not be desecrated.

Last edited by lowing (2006-05-29 05:38:11)

2006-05-29 05:37:46
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

CameronPoe wrote:

Xietsu wrote:

The flag of a country is always a symbol of the hardships it's endured through conception and formation, and to burn a flag, you spit on everything associated with that country.
The symbol of the hardships endured by a coutnry should be enshrined in the freedom of any of its citizens to burn the flag of that country, if they so choose.
You do know that by burning your flag you are turning your back against your country and NOT your government don't you??
2006-05-29 05:39:04
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6564

lowing wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Xietsu wrote:

The flag of a country is always a symbol of the hardships it's endured through conception and formation, and to burn a flag, you spit on everything associated with that country.
The symbol of the hardships endured by a coutnry should be enshrined in the freedom of any of its citizens to burn the flag of that country, if they so choose.
You do know that by burning your flag you are turning your back against your country and NOT your government don't you??
In my opinion all it is is a symbol, that's all. By burning a flag you are harming no one. A country is much more than just a flag.

PS - A dead body is just wormfood imo. But then again I'm an immoral evil aetheist so I guess you can just disregard this comment.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-05-29 05:40:38)

2006-05-29 05:41:11
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

CameronPoe wrote:

lowing wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:


The symbol of the hardships endured by a country should be enshrined in the freedom of any of its citizens to burn the flag of that country, if they so choose.
You do know that by burning your flag you are turning your back against your country and NOT your government don't you??
In my opinion all it is is a symbol, that's all. By burning a flag you are harming no one. A country is much more than just a flag.
and by burning your flag you are showing your disdain for your COUNTRY. If not that, then what?
2006-05-29 05:42:17
Xietsu
Banned
+50|6565
Of course you are harming nobody. Of course a flag is just a symbol. But it's a symbol of a lot. To burn such a symbol is to be immoral (i.e. To burn a cross spits on the beliefs of untold numbers). But hey...all of their beliefs are illogical anyways. You can't sensically identify a path of spiritual following, because in actuality, no path is the right path (were people to hold an allegiance to rationality). But uh..."kinda'" off topic...but...meh.
2006-05-29 05:42:42
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

CameronPoe wrote:

lowing wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:


The symbol of the hardships endured by a coutnry should be enshrined in the freedom of any of its citizens to burn the flag of that country, if they so choose.
You do know that by burning your flag you are turning your back against your country and NOT your government don't you??
In my opinion all it is is a symbol, that's all. By burning a flag you are harming no one. A country is much more than just a flag.

PS - A dead body is just wormfood imo. But then again I'm an immoral evil aetheist so I guess you can just disregard this comment.
LOL, well evil or not, you have to admit there are laws against this, and you have to admit why these laws are in place.
2006-05-29 05:44:21
Xietsu
Banned
+50|6565
LOL, at the same time, both CameronPoe and I have chosen to make religious reference.

(albeit mine being the more superior one...rawfullawllz )

Last edited by Xietsu (2006-05-29 05:45:05)

2006-05-29 05:45:34
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6564
As far as I am aware flag desecration is legal here, as it is in many european countries. I think we must just be more open minded and relaxed about things like this. That's not to say people don't get upset, but the desecrator won't be going to jail for it!

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-05-29 05:46:08)

2006-05-29 05:51:50
Xietsu
Banned
+50|6565
Of course not. People should just dislike that person quite a degree, unless they burn the flag symbolic of that which is widely disrespected (i.e. Nazi Swastika, anyone?).
2006-05-29 06:18:55
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6570

anzus wrote:

Ok I dare you. Please make sure channel 7 is there so I can watch.
I have no reason to burn a flag.  If I did, and it was a good reason, I would have no problems with burning it.  Particularly since a quarter of it is British.
2006-05-29 06:30:10
DazBurt
Kinda Nice Guy!
+10|6670|In The Zone
Way back when in the days of yore, armies used to carry the flag of their nation into battle, it was *THE MOST* highly defended thing on the battlefield, even more so than the General, Why was this?

This was done because it was the symbol that everyone was fighting for, it was the reason that all those soldiers were there, and it gave them all something to be proud of.  In those days it *WAS* illegal to burn a flag, but this was before freedom of speech.  Now that we have freedom of speech, anyone can say/do anything no matter how offensive it is.

Cartoons of the Prophet Muhammed - Everyone knows about this.  It was done by a Danish cartoonist, so why were muslims in London burning the UK flag?  Why did they have signs calling for the aforementioned cartoonist to be beheaded.  This is not Freedom of Speech.  This was a bunch of muppets, hoping to get people all riled up so they will have another reason to blame all their problems on,

I am proud of my country, and I am proud to serve her majesty on whatever piece of soil she tells me to go to, and I will do my damndest to bring freedom to that part of the soil, but if anybody was to burn a flag in front of me then they had better have a good reason for it (and I would pause for them to give that reason). 

I am not a religious man, but I do not agree with a lot of Doctrine that comes from the church, so what would happen if I stood outside a church and burned a cross?  After all, it is only a symbol, and I am protesting.  What is the differance?  It is not just a piece of material, or freedom of speech (because you are not saying anything).

It is a symbol of all the sacrifice that anyone has *ever* made.  Be it by fighting abroad for people who dont even like you or running across the road to punch the idiot burning the flag.  As a final point, I dont know of any country (except Belgium) that would jail you for punching someone who was burning the flag because they were inciting violence when they lit it.

Go ahead and -1 Karma me for this post but be a man and leave your name so I know who to avoid in the forum or hunt down on the battlefield (I will +1 you for having the Balls)
2006-05-29 06:38:45
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6570

DazBurt wrote:

It is a symbol of all the sacrifice that anyone has *ever* made.  Be it by fighting abroad for people who dont even like you or running across the road to punch the idiot burning the flag
Punching someone in the face is a sacrifice?

DazBurt wrote:

As a final point, I dont know of any country (except Belgium) that would jail you for punching someone who was burning the flag because they were inciting violence when they lit it.
Uh-huh.  Inciting violence.  That'll totally fly in an Australian court of law............really.............

DazBurt wrote:

Go ahead and -1 Karma me for this post but be a man and leave your name so I know who to avoid in the forum or hunt down on the battlefield (I will +1 you for having the Balls)
If anyone -1 karmas you, I would recommend not giving them + karma even if they leave their name.  YOu post is long, thought out, and provides reasons.  Negative karma should only be used for posts which lack reason, or are blatantly racist/sexist etc.  I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it, no?

Last edited by Bubbalo (2006-05-29 06:39:15)

2006-05-29 07:26:13
Knochenmann_AUT
Member
+1|6735

DazBurt wrote:

Way back when in the days of yore, armies used to carry the flag of their nation into battle, it was *THE MOST* highly defended thing on the battlefield, even more so than the General, Why was this?

This was done because it was the symbol that everyone was fighting for, it was the reason that all those soldiers were there, and it gave them all something to be proud of.
Yes, and in those days, the soldiers were forced to wear colorful uniforms (red, orange, blue, whatever), they walt in the middle of the road, singing nice songs like "Pleace shoot us, pleace shoot us...". They were standing in an open field and fired on other stupid dresst soldiers.

I'm pretty sure, those solders would have loved to burn a flag... after wrapping it arround an officer.
2006-05-29 08:29:04
DazBurt
Kinda Nice Guy!
+10|6670|In The Zone

Knochenmann_AUT wrote:

Yes, and in those days, the soldiers were forced to wear colorful uniforms (red, orange, blue, whatever), they walt in the middle of the road, singing nice songs like "Pleace shoot us, pleace shoot us...". They were standing in an open field and fired on other stupid dresst soldiers.

I'm pretty sure, those solders would have loved to burn a flag... after wrapping it arround an officer.
I am not denying that fact.  That was just the way things were done back then, and lets face it, Even I cant change History, lol
2006-05-29 13:22:42
Xietsu
Banned
+50|6565
Okay, calling the authorities so that they may handle a situation and running across a street to punch someone feeling threatening are two different things. Just thought I'd clarify.
2006-05-29 18:02:55
BallisticallyYours
Member
+23|6639|Chicago, IL

lowing wrote:

BallisticallyYours wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:

So it should be illegal to burn a Soviet flag?
In America, the amendments give we americans the right to burn a flag to excersise our right to protest of our government, thus the polish, mexican, african, british who live in america can burn their flags as well, it may not be the mature, moral thing to do, and others have the right to disagree with it, that is what freedom represents, live your life despite what others think of your actions, if you want to live that way. Simple.... where's the debate?
If you don't see the debate then you are a piss poor example of being an American.
Piss poor because? Your lack there of an explanation says little for your comprehention of the current argument.
You ought to take a look at what built this country, like I said right or wrong its a political excersize of your rights against THE GOVERNMENT, NOT YOUR COUNTRY..... read it in its entirety next time. I've seen war, beleive me flag burning as an expression against your government is the least of our problems, this shit is just beginning.
2006-05-29 18:12:47
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

BallisticallyYours wrote:

lowing wrote:

BallisticallyYours wrote:


In America, the amendments give we americans the right to burn a flag to excersise our right to protest of our government, thus the polish, mexican, african, british who live in america can burn their flags as well, it may not be the mature, moral thing to do, and others have the right to disagree with it, that is what freedom represents, live your life despite what others think of your actions, if you want to live that way. Simple.... where's the debate?
If you don't see the debate then you are a piss poor example of being an American.
Piss poor because? Your lack there of an explanation says little for your comprehention of the current argument.
You ought to take a look at what built this country, like I said right or wrong its a political excersize of your rights against THE GOVERNMENT, NOT YOUR COUNTRY..... read it in its entirety next time. I've seen war, beleive me flag burning as an expression against your government is the least of our problems, this shit is just beginning.
No, YOU don't understand!!!!!!!!...................Burning the flag isn't a protest against the govt......It is a protest against your nation!!!
2006-05-29 18:15:58
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6570
Or perhaps you're declaring that you would sooner burn the flag than see its' name ruined by the government.
Or your nation has not lived up to its' ideals, and that saddens you.
2006-05-29 19:09:54
BallisticallyYours
Member
+23|6639|Chicago, IL

lowing wrote:

BallisticallyYours wrote:

lowing wrote:


If you don't see the debate then you are a piss poor example of being an American.
Piss poor because? Your lack there of an explanation says little for your comprehention of the current argument.
You ought to take a look at what built this country, like I said right or wrong its a political excersize of your rights against THE GOVERNMENT, NOT YOUR COUNTRY..... read it in its entirety next time. I've seen war, beleive me flag burning as an expression against your government is the least of our problems, this shit is just beginning.
No, YOU don't understand!!!!!!!!...................Burning the flag isn't a protest against the govt......It is a protest against your nation!!!
According to whom? You have yet to provide documantation or yet otherwise to back up your claims....
2006-05-29 19:54:52
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

BallisticallyYours wrote:

lowing wrote:

BallisticallyYours wrote:


Piss poor because? Your lack there of an explanation says little for your comprehention of the current argument.
You ought to take a look at what built this country, like I said right or wrong its a political excersize of your rights against THE GOVERNMENT, NOT YOUR COUNTRY..... read it in its entirety next time. I've seen war, beleive me flag burning as an expression against your government is the least of our problems, this shit is just beginning.
No, YOU don't understand!!!!!!!!...................Burning the flag isn't a protest against the govt......It is a protest against your nation!!!
According to whom? You have yet to provide documantation or yet otherwise to back up your claims....
I don't need any facts or documentation to have an opinion that you are a piss poor American if you say you have the right to shit all over our flag.
2006-05-29 19:59:42
Brasso
member
+1,549|6639

I don't see the question.
"people in ny have a general idea of how to drive. one of the pedals goes forward the other one prevents you from dying"
2006-05-29 20:08:13
Xietsu
Banned
+50|6565

lowing wrote:

BallisticallyYours wrote:

lowing wrote:


No, YOU don't understand!!!!!!!!...................Burning the flag isn't a protest against the govt......It is a protest against your nation!!!
According to whom? You have yet to provide documantation or yet otherwise to back up your claims....
I don't need any facts or documentation to have an opinion that you are a piss poor American if you say you have the right to shit all over our flag.
A fine example of a particularly confused, supremacist, totalitarian being.
2006-05-29 20:21:07
BallisticallyYours
Member
+23|6639|Chicago, IL

Xietsu wrote:

lowing wrote:

BallisticallyYours wrote:


According to whom? You have yet to provide documantation or yet otherwise to back up your claims....
I don't need any facts or documentation to have an opinion that you are a piss poor American if you say you have the right to shit all over our flag.
A fine example of a particularly confused, supremacist, totalitarian being.
To whom are you reffering (Xietsu)? And for the record "lowing" I don't disagree with your opinion, the truth is all americans have the right, regrdless of how good an american they are, because you are just a shining example of what one is are you not?
2006-05-29 21:38:28
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

BallisticallyYours wrote:

Xietsu wrote:

lowing wrote:


I don't need any facts or documentation to have an opinion that you are a piss poor American if you say you have the right to shit all over our flag.
A fine example of a particularly confused, supremacist, totalitarian being.
To whom are you referring (Xietsu)? And for the record "lowing" I don't disagree with your opinion, the truth is all Americans have the right, regardless of how good an American they are, because you are just a shining example of what one is are you not?
You can dress it up anyway you want, the truth is desecrating our flag is desecrating our nation, not protesting the govt. And if you are proud of that than I want to see you try it in public, maybe around a military installation, or a defense plant, or even a shipyard. The simple fact is, you won't, because you know what that flag means to most of us and I don't think you could take the ass whipping you will get if you tried.
2006-05-29 21:47:12
yerded
Bertinator
+255|6645|Westminster, California
Okay, now that I know what I voted fuck no for lemme say this;

Don't outlaw stupidity. The U.S. must adhere to a higher standard and that means tollerating anti-state/flag speach and actions.
     When a line is crossed, such as the illegal alien invasion, or protesting gays at soldiers funerals, it becomes time to open a can of whoop ass.
     Americans can burn American flags, but it should be illegal to display a Mexican flag instead of or over a American flag.
     As for the asshole t.v. station in L.A. that recently made headlines by covering up the  Los Angeles banner with a  Mexico banner, I say BOMB THEIR ASSES!!!

 

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