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The Stillhouse Kid
Licensed Televulcanologist
+126|5688|Deep In The South Of Texas

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

The Stillhouse Kid wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:


The technology is here. The Freedom is here. When those two things exist to eliminate consequences of a certain poor choice, there are no more consequences. Only the choice to live with them or not.
So in other words, since it's possible to have an abortion then that makes it ok to make wrong choices?

Does it make it OK for someone to be a theif because I can afford to go out and replace what they steal from me?
Abortion is a wrong decision? Its legal.....but to answer you YES.....Since its possible (and legal) it is ok to have an abortion. It is your OPINION that it is wrong.

Your second statement has no relevance to the first. But I'll answer that too...

Yes it is ok to steal...but only from you.

My Karma box is right at the bottom there.....
I didn't say abortion is a wrong decision. Having unprotected sex when you're not willing to deal with the possibility of pregnancy is the wrong decision.

OK, the thief bit is a bad analogy, I admit. Let me put it this way:

Is it OK for someone to over-eat, not exercise and be overweight because they can go out and have liposuction, or would it be better to eat sensibly and exercise?
Mason4Assassin444
retired
+552|5708|USA

The Stillhouse Kid wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

The Stillhouse Kid wrote:


So in other words, since it's possible to have an abortion then that makes it ok to make wrong choices?

Does it make it OK for someone to be a theif because I can afford to go out and replace what they steal from me?
Abortion is a wrong decision? Its legal.....but to answer you YES.....Since its possible (and legal) it is ok to have an abortion. It is your OPINION that it is wrong.

Your second statement has no relevance to the first. But I'll answer that too...

Yes it is ok to steal...but only from you.

My Karma box is right at the bottom there.....
I didn't say abortion is a wrong decision. Having unprotected sex when you're not willing to deal with the possibility of pregnancy is the wrong decision.

OK, the thief bit is a bad analogy, I admit. Let me put it this way:

Is it OK for someone to over-eat, not exercise and be overweight because they can go out and have liposuction, or would it be better to eat sensibly and exercise?
My apologies for misquoting you.  I respect your opinion.

The fat person anology is ALOT better. That fat person though has the same freedom to do just that, as a skinny little startlet in Hollywood who gets it done. For whatever reason. It doesn't infringe on my rights.

I think what people think gives them the right to stalk a potential abortion seeker outside of the abortion clinic is they think they are saving a life. They think the mother is "killing" this baby. Regardless of the circumstances surrounding that pregnancy they have thier view and will make sure she hears it both arriving to the clinic and leaving from the clinic. She will be called a slut and a whore repeatedly for doing something perfectly legal. To me, those people should be able to be sued for slander and imposing their views on others.

Non-smokers don't want smoke around thier dining area.....I'll bet expecting mother's seeking an abortion don't want to hear that shit when they go to the clinic.

How about that analogy.
JaMDuDe
Member
+69|5823

Cougar wrote:

Me and my girlfriend abort a baby at least 5 or 6 times a year.

I really don't see much of a problem with it.
Are you really killing your babies because you do not want to wear a condom? Is that a joke? Is Abortion the new birth control?
Cougar
Banned
+1,962|5810|Dallas

JaMDuDe wrote:

Cougar wrote:

Me and my girlfriend abort a baby at least 5 or 6 times a year.

I really don't see much of a problem with it.
Are you really killing your babies because you do not want to wear a condom? Is that a joke? Is Abortion the new birth control?
Yes.  We have aborted over 25 babies in the past 3 years.  I do not see anything wrong with it.

On a side note, you should probably read the entire first page before quoting me.
JaMDuDe
Member
+69|5823
Fuzzball is right, its sick. I dont find not wanting to wear a condom a good enough reason to kill a baby. Making a bad mistake once is a different thing, but getting it done 5 or 6+ times a year because you dont want to use protection is just sick.
HisInfernalDeath
Member
+23|5770|Belgium
Sigh...
Pro abortion. Where are we going to leave all those unwanted kids ? Adoption ? No way. They are going to want to find their natural parents etc etc.. you all know that drama shit. The world is already exploding with masses of people, instead of discussing this crap moral issue, think about those LIVING kids who die every day ! Do something about that instead of whining about a foetus.
The Stillhouse Kid
Licensed Televulcanologist
+126|5688|Deep In The South Of Texas

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

My apologies for misquoting you.  I respect your opinion.

The fat person anology is ALOT better. That fat person though has the same freedom to do just that, as a skinny little startlet in Hollywood who gets it done. For whatever reason. It doesn't infringe on my rights.

I think what people think gives them the right to stalk a potential abortion seeker outside of the abortion clinic is they think they are saving a life. They think the mother is "killing" this baby. Regardless of the circumstances surrounding that pregnancy they have thier view and will make sure she hears it both arriving to the clinic and leaving from the clinic. She will be called a slut and a whore repeatedly for doing something perfectly legal. To me, those people should be able to be sued for slander and imposing their views on others.

Non-smokers don't want smoke around thier dining area.....I'll bet expecting mother's seeking an abortion don't want to hear that shit when they go to the clinic.

How about that analogy.
I just +1 Karma'd you. This is a good discussion, very civil and well conducted, which is all too often lacking. Too many Merry Andrews on the internet trying to be funny, never taking anything seriously.

At the root of my philosophy is personal responsibility for one's actions. I don't use the availability of a quick fix for a problem of my own creation as a license to take such a risk. I understand that discouragement is never going to eliminate things we may or may not think is right, like smoking, drinking, drug use or abortion. But does this mean that we should stop trying?

I don't know how old you are, but I was born in '73, shortly before Roe v. Wade. It's strange for me to think of which of my friends might not be around if that decision had come a few years earlier.
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,918|5678|949

We can debate whether or not a fetus/fertilized egg is alive until the world is destroyed.  Personally, I am pro-choice.  I would never want to kill something that I helped create, that shares my DNA, my genes, a half-likeness of myslef.  However, I believe it is wrong for me to tell someone else what to do.  I do not have the financial means to care for every child to be aborted.  It is easy to say no, abortion should not be legal.  That is a great ideology.  That is all it is.  The reality is that many people cannot afford to support a child.  "Well, those people shouldn't have one then."  Yes, they shouldn't, but they have, so what now?  Do we create a government program to help out families that would otherwise abort their kid?  I think most people who are pro-life are also against social programs in government.  I think it is short-sided to say, "abortion should be outlawed", yet not offer any solutions.  The reality is that people are going to have abortions, whether it be legal or illegal, in the U.S., or in Mexico, in a doctors office by trained professionals or in a back room by a greasy guy with a coat hanger.  I think it is more conducive to address the reality of the situation than argue ideological beliefs.  I think I can speak for everyone here when I say that no one wants to see a child killed, but at the same time, no one here wants to shoulder the burden of having to support other people's kids because the family is not financially stable enough.
Major_Spittle
Banned
+276|5701|United States of America

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Pro-Choice.

You remember your time in the womb?

Me either....
I drank alot the first week of college and still don't remember it, we should be free to kill all drunk people in their first week of college.

Yeh, I'm an idiot also......

"I feel abortion should be legalized from age 14-22, because that is the period when you really find out if the fetus worth keeping or not.  Vote for Major_Spittle and help support legistlating the "Full Birth Abortion" bill."

This message has been paid for by people for the ethical abortion of people and has been approved by Major_Spittle and the Americane Ad Council of Newhaven Conneticut 97019. All Licensing and terms are final, any cloning or stem cell reproduction of Mason4Assassin444 is strictly prohibited and anal sex with said person is not unusual.
Cougar
Banned
+1,962|5810|Dallas

JaMDuDe wrote:

Fuzzball is right, its sick. I dont find not wanting to wear a condom a good enough reason to kill a baby. Making a bad mistake once is a different thing, but getting it done 5 or 6+ times a year because you dont want to use protection is just sick.
You obviously didn't read the first page....
JaMDuDe
Member
+69|5823
wow. I read most of it i guess i missed a little part ^^ but if it were real it would be sick

Last edited by JaMDuDe (2006-04-20 13:42:09)

Cougar
Banned
+1,962|5810|Dallas
-1 for ju.
XstrangerdangerX
conversation is combat
+36|5675|Tasmania

The Stillhouse Kid wrote:

XstrangerdangerX wrote:

So, because she had unprotected sex she should bear the responsibilities of her actions?
Yes. If she made the conscious choice to pull down her panties and let the poor schmuck do his deed, then Hell yes she deserves to at least carry the baby to full term and give birth. If sex education failed to teach her the proper responsibility for her actions, perhaps this will. If you think you're responsible enough to fuck like an adult, then be prepared to deal with the possible consequences of your actions. It's not like they haven't been warned it could happen.

And where is the male in all this? Do those of you against abortion see no responsibility for the male?
Nope. The male is just as responsible as she is. He has the choice to keep his unit in his pants or wear a rubber just like she has the choice to keep her legs together. Why is is to terrible to compel someone to accept the consequences of their poor choices?
But the consequences of her having sex is 18 years of parental responsibility. As I stated, we don't put murderers in jail for that long. The punishment in my eyes far outweighs the crime.

Besides, ever had a baby? Ever lived 9 months with something growing inside you? Ever spent 18 years totaly subsuming yourself to the needs of another person? All because you had sex?
Mason4Assassin444
retired
+552|5708|USA

The Stillhouse Kid wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

My apologies for misquoting you.  I respect your opinion.

The fat person anology is ALOT better. That fat person though has the same freedom to do just that, as a skinny little startlet in Hollywood who gets it done. For whatever reason. It doesn't infringe on my rights.

I think what people think gives them the right to stalk a potential abortion seeker outside of the abortion clinic is they think they are saving a life. They think the mother is "killing" this baby. Regardless of the circumstances surrounding that pregnancy they have thier view and will make sure she hears it both arriving to the clinic and leaving from the clinic. She will be called a slut and a whore repeatedly for doing something perfectly legal. To me, those people should be able to be sued for slander and imposing their views on others.

Non-smokers don't want smoke around thier dining area.....I'll bet expecting mother's seeking an abortion don't want to hear that shit when they go to the clinic.

How about that analogy.
I just +1 Karma'd you. This is a good discussion, very civil and well conducted, which is all too often lacking. Too many Merry Andrews on the internet trying to be funny, never taking anything seriously.

At the root of my philosophy is personal responsibility for one's actions. I don't use the availability of a quick fix for a problem of my own creation as a license to take such a risk. I understand that discouragement is never going to eliminate things we may or may not think is right, like smoking, drinking, drug use or abortion. But does this mean that we should stop trying?

I don't know how old you are, but I was born in '73, shortly before Roe v. Wade. It's strange for me to think of which of my friends might not be around if that decision had come a few years earlier.
Good debate indeed.

You should not stop trying to fight valid battles. This is one. In certain issues there is so much to gain either way (depending on the view). This will sound very cold hearted and I will probably log on tomorrow and see a -400 on the ol' Karma.

Abortions, which are legal, can make unthinkable advances in stem cell research. These fetus do not have to be aborted in vain. It is legal so we may as well use the result for good. Our government makes those embryo's go to waste rather than pass them on to researchers to do what they will. The embryo's' provided for research are quite unusable.

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editor … _research/

I believe some feel stem cell research is too close to God. And this half-way research is kind of a go between to keep both sides happy....for a while. Who knows what is possible if we could research fresh new embryos.

And because Marijuana is illegal and no one will debate overturning those laws, we will never know the true medicinal value from its effects.

http://blogs.salon.com/0002762/stories/ … legal.html

Your last paragraph, I have nothing for. Very good point.

I do feel overturning Roe V Wade would do more harm than good.
The Stillhouse Kid
Licensed Televulcanologist
+126|5688|Deep In The South Of Texas

XstrangerdangerX wrote:

The Stillhouse Kid wrote:

XstrangerdangerX wrote:

So, because she had unprotected sex she should bear the responsibilities of her actions?
Yes. If she made the conscious choice to pull down her panties and let the poor schmuck do his deed, then Hell yes she deserves to at least carry the baby to full term and give birth. If sex education failed to teach her the proper responsibility for her actions, perhaps this will. If you think you're responsible enough to fuck like an adult, then be prepared to deal with the possible consequences of your actions. It's not like they haven't been warned it could happen.

And where is the male in all this? Do those of you against abortion see no responsibility for the male?
Nope. The male is just as responsible as she is. He has the choice to keep his unit in his pants or wear a rubber just like she has the choice to keep her legs together. Why is is to terrible to compel someone to accept the consequences of their poor choices?
But the consequences of her having sex is 18 years of parental responsibility. As I stated, we don't put murderers in jail for that long. The punishment in my eyes far outweighs the crime.
It need not be 18 years. Putting the baby up for adoption is an option.

I don't know where you're from, but here in Texas we don't sentence our murderers as lightly.

Besides, ever had a baby? Ever lived 9 months with something growing inside you? Ever spent 18 years totaly subsuming yourself to the needs of another person? All because you had sex?
Nope, can't say that I have done that. Because I made the choice not to put myself in a situation where that was a possibility. It's part of being an adult. If you're not ready for that, then my suggestion is, in order of importance:

1. Keep your pants on.

Or

2. Use birth control. Condom + the pill, diaphragm or IUD = next to no chance of pregnancy.

Why does this seem so difficult for some to do?
Mason4Assassin444
retired
+552|5708|USA
And just as a general comment, IUD's are alot better than condoms and birth control. They only prevent pregnancy, not disease. I just realized today, that not a lot of guys know these are available for women.
Me and my significant haven't had a problem and its good up to 10 years. And Insurance covered it. And if we want to try for a child, just make an appointment and 5 minute procedure.

http://www.fwhc.org/birth-control/iudinfo.htm

edit: Damn a few minutes late on the IUD comment.

Last edited by Mason4Assassin444 (2006-04-20 17:18:44)

MooseRyder
Member
+37|5701|Montréal, Canada

Cougar wrote:

JaMDuDe wrote:

Cougar wrote:

Me and my girlfriend abort a baby at least 5 or 6 times a year.

I really don't see much of a problem with it.
Are you really killing your babies because you do not want to wear a condom? Is that a joke? Is Abortion the new birth control?
Yes.  We have aborted over 25 babies in the past 3 years.  I do not see anything wrong with it.

On a side note, you should probably read the entire first page before quoting me.
isnt dangerous for a woman to get aborted that much?
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,915|5818|USA

XstrangerdangerX wrote:

Thought it might be interesting to read your opinions on this.

I'ma start it off in my usual hostile fashion by putting up a post I made elsewhere.

me wrote:

The abortion debate has passed into farce.

6000 children die each fucking day from lack of access to fresh water and you sit here discussing an individuals decision to terminate a single fucking foetus? This is a sickening effect of moral isolationism.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is it that we are blinded by our own media and it's lack of coverage or do we really not comprehend the fact that children die everyday from something so utterly banal?
Sure, kids die all the time, but usually a parent who murders them ends up in jail or a nuthouse.

The argument pro-lifers are trying to make is that unborn children are human beings, just as deserving of protection from murder as a newborn. The argument pro-choicers make is that unborn children are fetuses, not human beings, and that the mother of one should be able to legally 'terminate' it at will.

It all comes down to legalities and technicalities, but, I've seen dismembered babies on a tray, live babies fighting for breath, and videos of fetuses struggling against shredders and vacuum hoses, so I'm inextricably on the side of pro-life in this matter.

Unless it comes down to either an abortion or unavoidable death of the mother/child, I don't think 'terminate a single fucking foetus', as you put it, should be supported as a legal option.

Cougar wrote:

What?  My father is a preacher and he actually drove us to the abortion clinic the first time we had one done.  How am I a bad person?  Don't get me wrong, I would love to have children but we cannot afford our taxes if we do, so therfor we have to abort.  Someone actually gave us advice about condoms, but I can't keep wood very long with a condom, so abortion is the logical choice.

I don't see what the big deal is.  I mean my girl goes in there and has this done, she feels sick for a few days and then we are back at it and screwing again in no time.  I think we had 7 last year, 6 the year before that and 2 this year.  Around 18 or so since we've been together, and I sleep fine at night.
You must be being sarcastic. If so, fine. Otherwise, here's an alternative to mass abortion:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasectomy

It seems to me the more logical choice. "Being taxed" is a pathetic excuse.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-04-20 18:07:32)

GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|5690
when irresponsible people have children, chances are their children will be raised the same way. 


continuing the cycle

pro choice
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|5721|Canberra, AUS
I couldn't care less what women choose. It's THEIR choice. Therefore = pro-choice.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
JaMDuDe
Member
+69|5823
Cougar was just joking about getting so many abortions, i doubt he has a girlfriend
*TS*tphai
The Forum Alien
+89|5852|The planet Tophet
just to let you know abortion is pre medditated murder
jpost8391
Member
+7|5628|chantilly, va
there is no reason to Kill a fetus unless it is a major health risk to the mother. other then that my view is "If your too stupid to use a condom or birth control then your too stupid to have an abortion"   Pro-Life is my stance.
MooseRyder
Member
+37|5701|Montréal, Canada

*TS*tphai wrote:

just to let you know abortion is pre medditated murder
just to let u know, when ur waking up in front of ur porno websites, is a pre medditated mass murder
Skruples
Mod Incarnate
+234|5747

MooseRyder wrote:

*TS*tphai wrote:

just to let you know abortion is pre medditated murder
just to let u know, when ur waking up in front of ur porno websites, is a pre medditated mass murder
And when a woman has her period, that's involuntary manslaughter.

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