BF2S Forums Pro Illegal Immigration Protest

Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:

There was a march where I live on Sunday and Monday.  They kept saying they just wanted to live the American dream.  Part of the problem they don't seem to understand is that whenever you have a massive supply glut, economics is going to take over.  When supply exceeds demand by a large margin, this is only going to lead to additional exploitation and lowering of wages within the fields where they most commonly work.

Another thing to consider is that part of the reason identify theft is on the rise is that these identities are sold to illegals to get jobs.  Opponents of harsher immigration reform say that those with SS numbers are at least paying some taxes, but they don't tell you that due to the low wages earned by majority of illegals, that the taxes they pay do not offset the personal and taxpayer cost associated with the theft of the person's identity.

Racist.

Kidding.

From my standpoint, this is not a racial issue. The only ones making it a racial issue, are the protesters. Don't see me saying "send the mexicans home". I am saying "send EVERYONE home".

Why is it so hard to see people are breaking the law? They aren't called "illegal aliens" because they are law abiding citizens.

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Erkut.hv wrote:

From my standpoint, this is not a racial issue. The only ones making it a racial issue, are the protesters. Don't see me saying "send the mexicans home". I am saying "send EVERYONE home".

Why is it so hard to see people are breaking the law? They aren't called "illegal aliens" because they are law abiding citizens.

Why have we waited so long to enforce the law? We created it.

Votes for politicians & employers looking for a greater profit margin. Illegals are being whored out, and they don't realize it.

Edited for speeeling

Last edited by Erkut.hv (2006-04-11 09:57:28)

Erkut.hv wrote:

Mason4Assassin444 wrote:

Erkut.hv wrote:

From my standpoint, this is not a racial issue. The only ones making it a racial issue, are the protesters. Don't see me saying "send the mexicans home". I am saying "send EVERYONE home".

Why is it so hard to see people are breaking the law? They aren't called "illegal aliens" because they are law abiding citizens.

Why have we waited so long to enforce the law? We created it.

Votes for politicians & employers looking for a greater profit margin. Illegals are being whored out, and they don't realize it.

Edited for speeeling

Ding, ding, ding, give that man a prize!  And I'm with you.  It's not about them being Mexican, I want the laws the laws applied regardless of where the person comes from.  There are a lot people on the immigration waiting list (from all over the world), doing it right, doing it legal, and to just look the other way or offer amnesty because these people managed to sneak into the country and avoid getting cought just isn't right.

Now we're getting to the point.  Illegal's refer to people who overstay their visa, people who show up un-documented, folks who try to float in from cuba, etc.

This isn't about a bunch of janitors, meat packers, shit scoopers, and other sub par job doers.  A lot of illegals get sucked into doing this work "that black people won't do -Vicente Fox".  Granted some exploit it (employers) because they can make a killing with the undocumented workers.  And NON Citizens don't have rights when it comes to labor laws.  They're known as shadow crews.  I know of a meat packing plant that hires tons of non documented folks.  They let them know when INS is showing up and then all those people don't go in.  They post signs for A WEEK BEFORE HAND.  You can't fuck a US Citizen like that, but you CAN fuck an illegal like that.

But this isn't about people who do shit jobs you or I won't touch.  This is about increased surveilance of everyone in this country citizen and non citizen alike.  Notice piece by piece, stupid shit like this comes out of the woodwork on some guise of cleaning up the system helping those who want the dream of an American life.  It's a way to track everyone in or out of the country that isn't a US National.  Overstay your visa we have the right to throw you in Federal Prison (legally) for whatever term we decide, but now we have your "terrorist" ass so you aren't driving a Ryder truck into the elementary school or the Trans Union building.

Look at the big picture.  Wire taps on all calls for "suspicious" persons.  Harder tracking on non US Citizens and a way to throw their asses in jail for nothing.  You can make up any immigration violation you want.  Who's going to know?  Then poor visitor goes to jail on a felony and they don't get US Citizen rights.

This is just another systematic control of being able to know who does what, where and when.  And it's also a way of discouraging visitors because of fear of some violation that will land them in jail as a felon.

I don't know why the Mexicans/Latinos/Hispanics are taking it so personally.  It's not a united effort against them, but they're one of the largest affected groups.  Double edged sword but unfortunately they get caught in the middle.


One of my takes on it is making sure anyone who shows up as a non-citizen is sponsored for work or whatever and then the sponsors are responsible for making sure they get to become citizens.  It'd make the companies look good for attempting to stop the abuse of undocumented labor, but it'd also make them responsible for their sponsorees.

Another one as a joke, mine the whole border, divide it up into grids and pick your grids like Keno.  Who ever's grid explodes, you win based on your wager.  But there's more, if you make it past the minefield you have pisitions with .50 Cal machine guns, if you make it past the gunners, you get instant citizenship.

Kinda like the Running Man.

If there is to be a comprehensive plan in the US to stop illegal immigration, it is not going to be a tall fence or armed guards at the border.  The way to stop illegal immigration is to take away the motivation.  I believe most illegal immigrants come to the US to make money.  I do not believe that illegals come to this country to take advantage of our government's resources and programs.  If you want illegal immigration to stop, start fining the businesses that are benefitting from illegal work.  It is well known that a majority of illegal immigrants get low-paying jobs as janitors, maids, construction workers, cooks, farmworkers, and meatpackers.  It is debatable whether or not legal citizens would be willing to do this work, but the fact remains that illegals make up the majority of these workers.  To stop them (illegals) from getting these jobs, stop these companies/industries from allowing them to work.  This can realistically be done through fines, oversight/regulations.  It is not realistic to station more people at the borders, or build a higher/eletrical/plasma-cannon shooting fence.  There is a reason that our government as a whole brings up expedient and ineffective measures to combat the growing problem of illegal immigration.

People in power in the U.S. NEED a cheap workforce that can be exploited.  That is the bottom line.  The upper class needs the lower class, because that is how they make their money.  The middle class just acts like a buffer between the two, keeping distance.  We (people of the forums) are generally part of the middle class, and the upper class use us to increase the pressure on illegal immigration.  However, they do not want too much pressure, because then they (the upper class) will see their profit margins drop.  So they bring about half-assed bills and initiatives that sound good to the average citizen, but in reality do nothing to curtail the problem.

Now I agree that illegal immigration is a problem within the U.S., and I do not agree with illegals coming here, working under the table, and sending the money back to their home country.  However, I do not have a problem with illegals coming here to try to better their life and live the oft-alluded to "American Dream."  Most if not all people on these forums are here in the U.S. because some relative of theirs wanted that "American Dream" for their own families.  I believe if you are willing to come to our country, learn the language, and make a genuine attempt to become an American, there should be no reason to stop you.

Here in GA, there is a law that passed both house and senate , but hasn't been signed yet (I don't think).  Two of the key things it does is:
a. The proposed law would require employers to maintain valid employment authorization documents for employees in order to claim a tax deduction for wages, and to verify the legal status of employees through a federal work authorization program if the business held contracts with state or local agencies.  (penalize employers for hiring illegals) ( I copied this from http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnf … =rss_daily)
b. impose a 5 percent fee on illegal immigrants who use wire transfers to send money out of the country (http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/shared … ves_1.html)
It also blocks illegals from using state benefits in most situations.
EDIT: I have tried to find something with a detailed list of what the bill does, but can't find it.

Last edited by atlvolunteer (2006-04-11 13:00:59)

atlvolunteer wrote:

Here in GA, there is a law that passed both house and senate , but hasn't been signed yet (I don't think).  Two of the key things it does is:
a. The proposed law would require employers to maintain valid employment authorization documents for employees in order to claim a tax deduction for wages, and to verify the legal status of employees through a federal work authorization program if the business held contracts with state or local agencies.  (penalize employers for hiring illegals) ( I copied this from http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnf … =rss_daily)

Great idea, but still needs work for the private sector.  Good steps

atlvolunteer wrote:

b. impose a 5 percent fee on illegal immigrants who use wire transfers to send money out of the country (http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/shared … ves_1.html)

Only on illegal immigrants that send money?  How would they prove a person's legal right to live there?  Plenty illegals have faked documents.

Mr.Pieeater wrote:

GotMex? wrote:

I already made it across so I couldn't care less

Don't drop the soap when your in prison burrito-boy.

I forgot to emphasize that I came in the legal way... probably more legal than you are.

GotMex? wrote:

Mr.Pieeater wrote:

GotMex? wrote:

I already made it across so I couldn't care less

Don't drop the soap when your in prison burrito-boy.

I forgot to emphasize that I came in the legal way... probably more legal than you are.

Well, I didn't "come" here chief.  I was "born" here.  And I respect you for coming the right way.  *pat pat*

I'll post what I posted in the other thread on immigration:

B.Schuss wrote:

It is only natural for people living in countries that give them no opportunities for economical and social improvement to leave that country and try to make a better living in some other place.

A lot of great-great-grandfathers of those calling themselves US citizens now did exactly that in the 19th century, going to America, hoping to have a better life. America is a classic immigration country.

Moreover, the west needs immigration. As it is now, western nations have incredibly low birth rates. If we want to keep up our social systems and our economies, we need immigrants to fill the spots that are going to be left open by a generation of young people who do not have children.

Of course, we would like to chose the immigrants that come to our countries. We want the well-educated ones who fit in easily, who pay taxes, who won't be a burden on our social systems.

The sad reality is though, that the majority of those who want to come, are the less educated, who mostly won't fit in well, and who will be a burden on our social systems.

Do we need immigration reform ? You bet we do. Do we need to prepare potential immigrants better so they have a chance to integrate successful into our society and culture ? Absolutely.

But at the same time, we must have the right to ask certain things from possible immigrants. The ability to speak our language, for example, and the will to respect our laws. I don't think that's asking too much.

B.Schuss wrote:

to me, the race is really a non-issue too. Wether you are an illegal alien or not, doesn't depend on your ethnic background. Illegal aliens can be white, black, asian, whatever. Important is only your legal status as far as citizenship or working permit / visum is concerned.

But I do have a feeling that some minority groups try to make this a racial issue by deliberately playing the race card in this discussion.

But why should I allow others to call me racist simply when I try to fight illegal immigration and enforce the laws my country has set up to do so ?

This is pure lobbying on the part of the hispanic minority groups. I understand that. They have a right to fight for the rights of the group they represent. I don't dispute that. But this should not include defending those members of their community who are in the US illegally.

Calling other people racist while at the same time wearing symbols of racial supremacy, is just plain stupid and surely doesn't help their cause.

btw, before quoting me out of context I would advise anyone to read the whole thread first..

http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=18997&p=1

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

most the people in the rallies are NOT undocumented, you racist motherfuckers.

Resulting to name calling is not the best way to show your opinion. I would like to know how  wanting people to migrate into our society the proper way makes me racist. Millions of people have been doing this for hundreds of years. Can you not understand the need for this? Calling me a racist for wanting to have lawful entry in this country is just pathetic.

i wasnt showing opinion, i was stating a fact.  And anyone who assumes that the people at the rallies are all illegal immigrants is a racist motherfucker.  If the shoe fits wear it dont try to twist this around.  But Im clearly outnumbered by a large proportion of the population who is not of my skin color in these forums (oh wait we got a 1/8 hispanic guy out here.....lol) so im out.

William Wilbanks wants to know:
1) “What is your definition of racism?” and
2) “How does it apply to the situation at hand?”