Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5577

The reason, administrators say, is that students have learned there is a price to pay — literally — for breaking even the smallest rules.

Noble Network of Charter Schools charges students at its 10 Chicago high schools $5 for detentions stemming from infractions that include chewing gum and having untied shoelaces. Last school year it collected almost $190,000 in discipline “fees” from detentions and behavior classes — a policy drawing fire from some parents, advocacy groups and education experts.

Officials at the rapidly expanding network, heralded by Mayor Rahm Emanuel as a model for the city, say the fees offset the cost of running the detention program and help keep small problems from becoming big ones. Critics say Noble is nickel-and-diming its mostly low-income students over insignificant, made-up infractions that force out kids administrators don’t want.

“We think this just goes over the line … fining someone for having their shoelaces untied (or) a button unbuttoned goes to harassment, not discipline,” said Julie Woestehoff, executive director of the Chicago advocacy group Parents United for Responsible Education, which staged protests last week over the policy after Woestehoff said she was approached by an upset parent

Students at Noble schools receive demerits for various infractions — four for having a cellphone or one for untied shoelaces. Four demerits within a two-week period earn them a detention and $5 fine. Students who get 12 detentions in a year must attend a summer behavior class that costs $140.

Superintendent Michael Milkie said the policy teaches the kids — overwhelmingly poor, minority and often hoping to be the first in their families to attend college — to follow rules and produces in a structured learning environment. He points to the network’s average ACT score of 20.3, which is higher than at the city’s other non-selective public schools, and says more than 90 percent of Noble graduates enroll in college.

Woestehoff and Moore said some families have removed their children from Noble schools because they couldn’t keep paying the fees, though Moore said her biggest complaint is the infractions. Milkie said Noble sets up payment plans and on rare occasions waives the fees, and students never would be held back a grade solely because they couldn’t pay.

Even so, Matthew Mayer, a professor in the graduate school of education at Rutgers University, said a monetary fine is “highly inappropriate” because it likely has no bearing on students’ academic performance and disproportionately hurts poor families.

Parent Tammy O’Neal said her two daughters are excelling at Noble’s Muchin College Prep, and only one ever got detention, for not wearing a belt.
http://newsone.com/nation/associatedpre … -students/
Does anyone else find this ridiculous? I think it's pretty demeaning as well as counter productive to the learning process. I also wonder what the long-term psychological effects on the students under this system will be. While I understand Chicago and their schools are shit, I don't think the students and their families should have to suffer this just because of where they live. I think everyone should have equal educational opportunities in this country. I believe a school system like this just reinforces the education divide.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6763|PNW

I'd say fuck that school, but if it's a charter school, they're getting public money...

Needs to be addressed.
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6397|North Carolina
It's pretty classist, but this is the same city that has youth mobs robbing stores and individuals.

I can't say I'm surprised.  Detroit and Philly might have to do the same eventually.
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5349|London, England
It's $5. If that's an issue for them and their family, don't get demerits. Demerits are entirely voluntary.

It's comparable to military discipline, except forcing students to do pushups is considered demeaning or cruel. The military is very successful housebreaking new recruits with the same methods you use to train a dog: rub his nose in it, and give him a whack on the behind.

Attending that school is a choice. Abide by the rules or gtfo.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5577

Jay wrote:

It's $5. If that's an issue for them and their family, don't get demerits. Demerits are entirely voluntary.

It's comparable to military discipline, except forcing students to do pushups is considered demeaning or cruel. The military is very successful housebreaking new recruits with the same methods you use to train a dog: rub his nose in it, and give him a whack on the behind.

Attending that school is a choice. Abide by the rules or gtfo.
Uh huh
”It was nothing egregious, but just that the little things added up: a shirt unbuttoned, shoes not tied, not tracking the teacher with his eyes,” said Moore, adding that her son has an attention disorder.
Totally not excessive.

I am surprised Mr. Libertarian is so welcoming of harsh discipline and authoritarianism.

The U.S. also considers schooling a right. Not a choice.
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5349|London, England
Attending a charter school is entirely voluntary. Libertarianism has nothing to do with anything regarding this story. They volunteered to place themselves in an environment where 'harsh' discipline is the norm. If it was enacted in a place where it was involuntary, like a compulsory public school, then I would take issue with it. But it's not.

Again, it mimics military discipline, and complaining about the fines is like complaining about pushups. Some people fuck up more often and earn more pushups. This is alleviated by becoming properly house trained i.e. you stop performing the behaviors that lead to demerits, or pushups, or if stuck in a bear cage on Lost Island, electric shocks.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6402|'Murka

As with military discipline, it teaches attention to detail and constant situational awareness.

But if the parents wanted that, they should've sent their kids to military school.

Charter schools across the nation have different--and sometimes seemingly odd--policies. Most of them get results, education-wise.

If the policy was known and the parents sent their kids there anyway...fuck 'em. They made the choice to live under those rules.

If not, then fuck the school. That's nonsense.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

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