BF2S Forums Inmate hunger strike

Because our laws are more strict...

Dilbert_X wrote:

Do you even work in the aircraft industry?

there is something wrong with PEOPLE in our society

How is that your society seems to have more criminals than most others, despite the awsm standard of living?

Why would you ask that? Do you think I am lying?


Dunno, but like I said, the vast majority of us live in harmony with a substantial quality of life. If you can't stay out of trouble in the US, then YOU are the problem. Period.

Lol.

Why are you so obsessed with blame? It doesnt really matter whose fault something is in so far that it will not undo the crime. The action has already happened and the best you can hope for is to stop it being repeated. Whether that means removing the criminal from society or some other method to decrease the likelihood of re offending is unimportant but the aim should always be prevention rather than punishment.

Ive had enough of your quality of life argument so mull on this.

fullsize http://nationranking.files.wordpress.co … 1-qli2.png



Source http://nationranking.wordpress.com/2011/03/06/2011-qli/

Notice that USA is overall 31st. Behind Lithuania.

Trounced by Europe actually.

Id like to highlight "PEACE" where USA is positioned 81st.

What does PEACE mean?

Peace Index:

Security from crime, repression and armed conflict (15%)

Ah so the USA is really bad when it comes to dealing with crime. That cant be right surely?

Last edited by Cheeky_Ninja06 (2011-07-15 07:17:15)

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

Lol.

Why are you so obsessed with blame? It doesnt really matter whose fault something is in so far that it will not undo the crime. The action has already happened and the best you can hope for is to stop it being repeated. Whether that means removing the criminal from society or some other method to decrease the likelihood of re offending is unimportant but the aim should always be prevention rather than punishment.

Ive had enough of your quality of life argument so mull on this.

fullsize http://nationranking.files.wordpress.co … 1-qli2.png

http://nationranking.files.wordpress.co … 1-qli2.png

Source http://nationranking.wordpress.com/2011/03/06/2011-qli/

Notice that USA is overall 31st. Behind Lithuania.

Trounced by Europe actually.

Id like to highlight "PEACE" where USA is positioned 81st.

What does PEACE mean?

Peace Index:

Security from crime, repression and armed conflict (15%)

Ah so the USA is really bad when it comes to dealing with crime. That cant be right surely?

why do I assign blame? Because I am big on personal responsibility, and feel one is responsible for their own actions and not society as a whole.


Don't recall saying we had the highest quality of life. I said we have a high quality of life.

What do I mean about peace? the vast majority of us live our lives totally uneventful, no police presence in our lives, no drama.

AussieReaper wrote:

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

Of course they revamp the procedures. They increase the number of safety checks and the procedures the mechanic has to take are modified to limit the chance that the same error will occur.

Sorry Aussie, been doin this a lonnnnng time, and you are wrong. If the procedures are correct, and the mechanic simply didn't follow them, he is fucked they do not re-write the procedures. If the guy didn't torque the bolt to the specified torque they blame the failure on the mechanic, not the loose bolt.

I like how I say that of course procedures are revamped to improve safety and that extra checks are taken to avoid the error so your counter argument is that "If the procedures are correct... they do not re-write the procedures"

Adding in checks for human error does not require a re-write of procedures. Just an added check. It could be something as simple as ticking off a check list to confirm the steps taken have been correct. That isn't a re-write of procedures. It's a step to ensure the procedures were followed.

This shouldn't be a hard concept to follow from someone in your position, yet, here we are.

In that you are correct. However the BLAME for the failure is not placed on the procedure it is placed on the individual and he is punished, not rehabilitated. His rehabilitation and responsibility to make sure he does not fuck up again is solely on him.

classic lowing

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

lowing wrote:

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

You cited the "fact" that even your poorest citizens had a better quality of life than everybody else.

Unfortunately it appears that 80 other countries citizens are more secure from crime than the great US of A.

I am pretty sure I did not say our poor has a better quality of life than "everyone else" I am quite sure I said more than most other countries.

I bet the USSR had less crime than the US does as well, what is your point?

Well you are 81st out of 137 not exactly better than most is it? 60% of countries are better than you. Can you back pedal out of that?

Also note this isn't your poorest people this is your average citizen who is substantially better off than your poorest (besides your poorest are in jail).

There are only 137 countries in this world? I kinda thought there was somewhere around 200. I mean if you wanna get technical we can.

I was kinda going along the lines of our abundance of pretty much everything. 

Sorry, our poor still manages tv, cell phones, internet a car a roof over their heads etc....and no being poor in America is not the average.

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

Umm so quality of life boils down to wealth?

I think there are a few more things to take into account like crime, education, healthcare perhaps?

There are 137 countries where enough data is available to make a meaningful comparison.

Well it is kinda hard to argue that crime, education, healthcare are major factors to trash our society as not having a high quality of life since:

the vast majority of us avoid a life of crime.

we are the leaders in pretty much all major industry where your educated comes to look for a job.

and people that can afford it come to the US for their health care, instead of waiting along with the rest of you for months to be treated elsewhere.


no there are like 200 countries, if 63 of them cant be counted then it is probably a safe bet they are below most everyone else.

Last edited by lowing (2011-07-15 08:56:20)

Anyway lets get back to your assertion that criminals shouldn't be punished because they might repeat, that, we should compensate them instead.

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14070090

New life expectancy figures show Americans some way behind countries like Canada, the UK and Australia. Why?

While life expectancy in the US continues to improve, says the report by researchers at University of Washington in Seattle and Imperial College, London, it is not increasing as quickly as in other Western countries, so the gap is widening.

"The researchers suggest that the relatively low life expectancies in the US cannot be explained by the size of the nation, racial diversity, or economics," says the document, which ranks the US 38th in the world for life expectancy overall.

Yes the US healthcare system is where everybody goes, unless they are in the 37 countries with a better system....

wiki wrote:

Compared with other countries, the United States has the highest incarceration rate in the world. As of 2006, a record 7 million people were behind bars, on probation or on parole, of which 2.2 million were incarcerated. The People's Republic of China ranks second with 1.5 million. The United States has 5% of the world's population and 25% of the world's incarcerated population.

5% of the worlds population and 25% of the prison population? Sounds like the USA have no crime problem at all, clearly have the whole thing going pretty well there.

The leaders in all major industry? Thats a bold claim.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13850575

High up in the Sierra Nevada mountains in California, half hidden by a snow drift, a disused railway tunnel is a monument to the Chinese labourers who helped build modern America in the 1860s. Now, 150 years later, the Chinese could be returning to build the next generation of US railways, but in a very different role.

One of the favourite bids for the project has come from a Chinese consortium, and it is China which has built more high-tech, high-speed rail links than anyone else in the last year.

"It's kind of funny, kind of ironic - what goes around comes around," said Don Davis from the Truckee Donner Railroad Society.

Professor Richard White from Stanford University has studied the history of the railroads and is sceptical of whether this new line will be built.

"If this happens, which sometimes I have grave doubts about, it would be an almost total reversal from 150 years ago," Mr White said.

"What you had then was American capital, American technology and cheap Chinese labour," he added.

"The way they are talking about building it now will be American labour laying the tracks, but heavy investments in Chinese technology and even trying to get inputs of Chinese capital.

"It's as if the Pacific has suddenly switched over in 150 years."

It's a story that tells a lot about the changing world order.

Well thats a shining example of USA leading the way technologically.

Actually there are very very few items I own that say "made in the USA" on the back, perhaps parts of my pc but I think that is about it. Everything else says "made in China"

It is difficult to find statistics on how many UK people go to America to get a highly skilled job.

Oh look the top university in the world is.......Cambridge, UK. Clearly we are all flocking over to America for our education..

http://www.topuniversities.com/universi … kings/2010

Hmmm industry leaders..

High speed rail = China

Cars...

Manufacturer
Ford
Vauxhall
Volkswagen
Toyota
Peugeot
BMW
Audi
Nissan
Honda
Citroen

Market share
13.81% with 280,364 (-11.38)
12.18% with 247,265 (+3.96)
8.60% with 174,655 (+8.39)
4.30% with 87,396 (-14.83)
5.38% with 109,324 (+6.58)
5.39% with 109,418 (+10.88)
4.92% with 99,828 (+9.49)
4.42% with 89,681 (+15.09)
3.13% with 63,652 (-14.93)
3.61% with 73,317 (+1.20)

Vauxhall, VW, BMW & Audi ..... That would be Germany then.

Cell phones, biggest manufacturers are Nokia, Samsung, LG, ZTE, & RIM. I dont think any of those are American?

Sorry what tech is USA leading the way in?

What this has to do with the fact that prison increases re offending I dont know...

plenty of articles where Canadians come across the border for healthcare, sorry.

in our country there is something like 3 percent that have serious crime issues. Hence the vast majority of the US doesn't have a problem.

I suppose when you live in a nanny state, you might be safer, but for us, that price is way too high.

There is no doubt, our leadership roll in the world is going down the tubes, but that is a reflection of how spoiled we are due to our own over abundant life style and our gluttony and the fact that we all some decided we are entitled to those things instead of having to work for them.   

I don't buy anything made in the USA. All my shit is JApanese I am proud to say. Since I can afford it, and I have no problem watching companies sink in a competitive marketplace. Still back to our quality of life. Crime is not a factor in the majority of our lives, neither is healthcare, we have (insurance). As far as education goes, we seem to be educated enough to maintain our life styles which includes homes and land and not a 500 sq ft flats on top of someone else. I got elbow room,  to me that goes a long way to quality of life, but I do get your point, the USA is sinking and I agree.

Now then, what sort of nanny state do you suggest we model after so we can remove personal responsibility from the individual,and make sure we compensate them for their crimes ya know, like you suggested.

What tech is the US a leader in? Ever hear of IBM maybe APPLE how about Micorsoft? all of which is a must for anything to get done including designing your cell phones and cars.

Last edited by lowing (2011-07-15 16:03:47)

Iceland, Norway, Sweden Switzerland would be a good places to start as they win at your quality of life claims.

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

Iceland, Norway, Sweden Switzerland would be a good places to start as they win at your quality of life claims.

Yes you have selected some fine nanny states there, but I think I will choose my quality of life without big brother's dictations thank you.

Of course once again this is the situation:

Uzique wrote:

present to you, LOWING

Ferrous Cranus is utterly impervious to reason, persuasion and new ideas, and when engaged in battle he will not yield an inch in his position regardless of its hopelessness. Though his thrusts are decisively repulsed, his arguments crushed in every detail and his defenses demolished beyond repair he will remount the same attack again and again with only the slightest variation in tactics. Sometimes out of pure frustration Philosopher will try to explain to him the failed logistics of his situation, or Therapist will attempt to penetrate the psychological origins of his obduracy, but, ever unfathomable, Ferrous Cranus cannot be moved.