Nah mate, gotta get some sleep.
Night <3
Night <3
<3
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something. - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
Appreciate the support and pretense that you care, how much do I owe you?Jaekus wrote:
Let it all out now, there's a good fellow.13rin wrote:
Not a fan, I just pulled the where have you been tread as I was curious to see how many places such a refined, pinky off the stem guy such as yourself has traveled. I was totally shocked to learn you've yet to leave that shithole called australia.
I decided to fuck with you as you seemingly enjoy attempting to troll lowing. I just kinda feel sad for you... Kidding, not really.
Feel better? Keep going if you do.
You might want to perhaps revise the "... nah just kidding" thing though. I remember using that in primary school, and I grew out of it by the time I reached puberty.
Yeah I probably am dull. I avoid drama in my life, I do not live a life full of EXCITING drugs, criminal behavior, welfare, or intruding on the lives of others. I made my decisions that benefit MY life, and to be honest, I made some pretty good decisions, and was able to correct the wrong decisions I have made, without taking advantage of anyone else.Jaekus wrote:
I dunno dude, your personality just comes across as being so... dull.
And keep talking about my job, it's mildly amusing to see what other descriptions you can come up with.
nada... A bit tiresome that everyone seems to put a bullseye on you, not that you aren't consistent and logical about much of it.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something. - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
After Alllllllll of what you haver said, you are great at trashing what others suggest, yet, you yourself, have not offered a single solution you are confident in to risk criticism. So tell ya what, you think prison is a failure and rehab is a failure. Go ahead and hit me with your suggestions.Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:
And not a truer thing has been said in this thread.jaekus wrote:
I now await for you to completely misinterpret what I said and put words in my mouth insinuating I mean something elseWhere to begin..lowing wrote:
So much that makes me rage
I am not your brother.
Prison is there to remove people from society. Not to make them miserable, or to appease victims or anything else it is literally for people who need to be separated from society. There will always be a need for prison in this capacity. However once you start getting up to the prison populations we are currently seeing in the US and UK you get to the point where such a significant proportion of society is in prison that you arent really separating people out anymore.
No Lowing. If people return to prison that means that whatever they went through the first time they committed a crime did not work. Surely the whole point of punishment is to discourage somebody from doing something. If it is not working to discourage an activity then one needs to ask two questions: Why? and What is the alternative?
Why do we arrest people who do crimes? Its not to make people feel better its to try and catch those responsible and stop them from doing it again. If they continue to commit crimes then what is the point in arresting them? You might as well just leave them to it.
I did not mention drug abuse so i am not sure where that reference comes from.
Presumably you are suggesting that prison should be solitary confinement so that inmates do not have any chance of socialising with one another. I'm not sure how you will reintegrate anybody back into society who has been in solitary for 2 years. I suppose you will argue that's not your problem though even though if they fail to reintegrate into society then it is society that pays the price.
You dont think prison has anything to do with victims as you do not care if your measures create future victims. Its all about revenge with you at the expense of everything else.
You are even driving me to agree with dilbert, he said that there is no point exacting revenge for a crime that need not have happened. This is the bit you are struggling with. Punishment for an offence is locking the door after the horse has bolted. Surely it is far better to prevent the horse getting away in the first place / to prevent a crime occurring. Re offending on many occasions is an avoidable crime. The justice / criminal / prison system has already had its best shot at preventing it and has failed.
Sure you are never going to have a 100% success rate. Hell even a 50% would be a massive achievement but you can do much better than we are at the moment.Lowing, explain the benefits to society of incentivising crime?jaekus wrote:
What's the point in punishing someone, reducing their life skills and then kicking them out with no hope in society? If anything they have more incentive to commit crime.Even your poor have a greater quality of life than a lot of other nations?lowing wrote:
Dunno Dilbert, but since the vast majority of Americans, even our poor have a greater quality of life than a lot of other nations, I would hardly say our system doesn't work.
I hope you aren't including life expectancy in quality of life as the US is falling further and further behind on that particular statistic. I also take massive issue with this huge unsubstantiated claim. There are millions of people in other countries that are far better off than the USA's poorest. I would also suggest that a significant proportion of your poorest are in fact in prison. Therefore when you get your way and make prison hell the USAs poorest will be significantly worse off than the rest of the world. Well played.
I dont have the answer im afraid. I wasn't aware this was a religious discussion where one professes to have an answer for everything.
Trashing everything others suggest is a bit of a stretch, its only you that I disagree with. You asserted that rehab was a complete failure and hence a waste of time and banged on about low success rates. I pointed out that prison has the same low success rates.
I think anybody can see that if something is not working, carrying on isn't going to turn into success. The whole system needs a serious review by people far more knowledgeable on the subject than me, and then it needs a parliament that will act upon the recommendations.
To be honest I suspect the real solution is a complicated balance between grouping like offenders, some sort of compulsory rehab, voluntary education to increase job prospects, compensation rather than jail where appropriate, suspended sentences for first offences, and a whole host of other measures aimed at reducing re offending as the primary objective.
Trashing everything others suggest is a bit of a stretch, its only you that I disagree with. You asserted that rehab was a complete failure and hence a waste of time and banged on about low success rates. I pointed out that prison has the same low success rates.
I think anybody can see that if something is not working, carrying on isn't going to turn into success. The whole system needs a serious review by people far more knowledgeable on the subject than me, and then it needs a parliament that will act upon the recommendations.
To be honest I suspect the real solution is a complicated balance between grouping like offenders, some sort of compulsory rehab, voluntary education to increase job prospects, compensation rather than jail where appropriate, suspended sentences for first offences, and a whole host of other measures aimed at reducing re offending as the primary objective.
If you think those things make an interesting person... I rest my case.lowing wrote:
Yeah I probably am dull. I avoid drama in my life, I do not live a life full of EXCITING drugs, criminal behavior, welfare, or intruding on the lives of others. I made my decisions that benefit MY life, and to be honest, I made some pretty good decisions, and was able to correct the wrong decisions I have made, without taking advantage of anyone else.Jaekus wrote:
I dunno dude, your personality just comes across as being so... dull.
And keep talking about my job, it's mildly amusing to see what other descriptions you can come up with.
Why are you always "resting your case", yet you never shut the fuck up? Your case is rested, now disappear.Jaekus wrote:
If you think those things make an interesting person... I rest my case.lowing wrote:
Yeah I probably am dull. I avoid drama in my life, I do not live a life full of EXCITING drugs, criminal behavior, welfare, or intruding on the lives of others. I made my decisions that benefit MY life, and to be honest, I made some pretty good decisions, and was able to correct the wrong decisions I have made, without taking advantage of anyone else.Jaekus wrote:
I dunno dude, your personality just comes across as being so... dull.
And keep talking about my job, it's mildly amusing to see what other descriptions you can come up with.
religious discussion? You got the wrong guy.Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:
I dont have the answer im afraid. I wasn't aware this was a religious discussion where one professes to have an answer for everything.
Trashing everything others suggest is a bit of a stretch, its only you that I disagree with. You asserted that rehab was a complete failure and hence a waste of time and banged on about low success rates. I pointed out that prison has the same low success rates.
I think anybody can see that if something is not working, carrying on isn't going to turn into success. The whole system needs a serious review by people far more knowledgeable on the subject than me, and then it needs a parliament that will act upon the recommendations.
To be honest I suspect the real solution is a complicated balance between grouping like offenders, some sort of compulsory rehab, voluntary education to increase job prospects, compensation rather than jail where appropriate, suspended sentences for first offences, and a whole host of other measures aimed at reducing re offending as the primary objective.
Great you want to disagree with what I say, what is it, YOU DO agree with, I mean other than "we gotta come up with a different approach"?
What isn't working is a soft prison system that lets fuckers out early.
I got it, so you see a convicted felon and you want to compensate and educate them and let them off with a slap on the wrist for a first offense, I hope you don't mind if I stick with my opinion instead.
Last edited by lowing (2011-07-15 02:05:05)
I've really looked for the outcome of the starvation. Haven't seen one yet reported in the media... If they caved, I'll never see pelican bay in the same light.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something. - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
I can post here if I wish. I rest my case mainly because logic doesn't seem to work :-)lowing wrote:
Why are you always "resting your case", yet you never shut the fuck up? Your case is rested, now disappear.Jaekus wrote:
If you think those things make an interesting person... I rest my case.lowing wrote:
Yeah I probably am dull. I avoid drama in my life, I do not live a life full of EXCITING drugs, criminal behavior, welfare, or intruding on the lives of others. I made my decisions that benefit MY life, and to be honest, I made some pretty good decisions, and was able to correct the wrong decisions I have made, without taking advantage of anyone else.
Would you think they would report it if they did? I'm unsure tbh.13rin wrote:
I've really looked for the outcome of the starvation. Haven't seen one yet reported in the media... If they caved, I'll never see pelican bay in the same light.
Logic, what fuckin logic have you presented? Telll ya what, I wish the hell, I had a job like yours where a 95-100% failure rate is acceptable and considered successful. I can't even get away with 10-36% failure rate. So much for your logic.Jaekus wrote:
I can post here if I wish. I rest my case mainly because logic doesn't seem to work :-)lowing wrote:
Why are you always "resting your case", yet you never shut the fuck up? Your case is rested, now disappear.Jaekus wrote:
If you think those things make an interesting person... I rest my case.
I don't work in rehab dude. Try again
Oh sorry, what kind of pretend caring do you get paid to offer then?Jaekus wrote:
I don't work in rehab dude. Try again
If you have to ask that you'll never know.
Lol I work with other peoples money and being 5% off is a complete failure. Yet I still understand that incentivising crime is daft.lowing wrote:
Logic, what fuckin logic have you presented? Telll ya what, I wish the hell, I had a job like yours where a 95-100% failure rate is acceptable and considered successful. I can't even get away with 10-36% failure rate. So much for your logic.Jaekus wrote:
I can post here if I wish. I rest my case mainly because logic doesn't seem to work :-)lowing wrote:
Why are you always "resting your case", yet you never shut the fuck up? Your case is rested, now disappear.
My job isn't measured in black and white statistics. Something certain people will never get their prehistoric heads around how a sector operates like that. But I'm not going to waste my time explaining to those who exercise their freedom to remain ignorant.
Well, I guess that is true, if one has to ask, he doesn't know, and if the one he asks will never answer, then yup, he will never know.Jaekus wrote:
If you have to ask that you'll never know.
Last edited by lowing (2011-07-15 05:09:29)
incentivising crime? I don't want to incentivise crime. I want to punish crime. Ya see I can not agree with you that, since they might do it again, punishing them the first time, is wrong.Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:
Lol I work with other peoples money and being 5% off is a complete failure. Yet I still understand that incentivising crime is daft.lowing wrote:
Logic, what fuckin logic have you presented? Telll ya what, I wish the hell, I had a job like yours where a 95-100% failure rate is acceptable and considered successful. I can't even get away with 10-36% failure rate. So much for your logic.Jaekus wrote:
I can post here if I wish. I rest my case mainly because logic doesn't seem to work :-)
That sounds like a good thing for you, you can always disguise your failures in the fact that, your performance or success can not be measured so know one knows that you might suck, or that what you do is bullshit and it still charges 100 dollars an hour, for your "caring", 30, if you got insurance.Jaekus wrote:
My job isn't measured in black and white statistics. Something certain people will never get their prehistoric heads around how a sector operates like that. But I'm not going to waste my time explaining to those who exercise their freedom to remain ignorant.
Last edited by lowing (2011-07-15 05:45:37)
Your crime rate is still rubbish, we're talking about that, not average quality of life.lowing wrote:
Dunno Dilbert, but since the vast majority of Americans, even our poor have a greater quality of life than a lot of other nations, I would hardly say our system doesn't work.Dilbert_X wrote:
So explain how the crime rate in your country is so much higher than most other countries.
Bearing in mind the US also has the highest proportion of people in prison and the death penalty.
System doesn't seem to be working, maybe you should look at systems which do.
I think I've identified the problem, 'punishing crime' is pointless, reducing crime should be the objective.I don't want to incentivise crime. I want to punish crime.
Its like concentrating on aircraft safety instead of flogging the pilots and mechanics every time an aeroplane crashes due to negligence.
Would it help to flog the pilots and mechanics every time an aeroplane crashes due to negligence?
Would it undeadify the casualties and make it unpossible for a crash to happen ever again?
Or does the industry have safety programs, no-blame reporting and so on which are focused on prevention instead of punishment?
You might want to think about it for a while.
Last edited by Dilbert_X (2011-07-15 06:17:34)
Fuck Israel
Well if the vast majority of Americans enjoy a decent quality of life, then that would suggest the problem lies with the individual and not some failure of society.Dilbert_X wrote:
Your crime rate is still rubbish, we're talking about that, not average quality of life.lowing wrote:
Dunno Dilbert, but since the vast majority of Americans, even our poor have a greater quality of life than a lot of other nations, I would hardly say our system doesn't work.Dilbert_X wrote:
So explain how the crime rate in your country is so much higher than most other countries.
Bearing in mind the US also has the highest proportion of people in prison and the death penalty.
System doesn't seem to be working, maybe you should look at systems which do.I think I've identified the problem, 'punishing crime' is pointless, reducing crime should be the objective.I don't want to incentivise crime. I want to punish crime.
Its like concentrating on aircraft safety instead of flogging the pilots and mechanics every time an aeroplane crashes due to negligence.
Would it help to flog the pilots and mechanics every time an aeroplane crashes due to negligence?
Would it undeadify the casualties and make it unpossible for a crash to happen ever again?
Or does the industry have safety programs, no-blame reporting and so on which are focused on prevention instead of punishment?
You might want to think about it for a while.
when an airplane crashes and it is determined to be pilot negligence or mechanic negligence not much is done to change the system but the pilot or mechanic is in trouble ( punished).
Take a pilot caught drunk flying, they do not revamp the safety protocols for the airlines, they just punish the pilot. If a plane crashes because the mechanic didn't follow the proper procedures, they do not revamp the procedures, they go after the mechanic. Sorry, your analogy does not work, and in fact, supported my position instead, that there is nothing wrong with our society, there is something wrong with PEOPLE in our society and I refuse to blame society for the mis-deeds of criminals. Why do liberals love to shuck responsibility from an individual an place it in some collective blame tank?
Do you even work in the aircraft industry?
How is that your society seems to have more criminals than most others, despite the awsm standard of living?there is something wrong with PEOPLE in our society
Fuck Israel