FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

And it's not because they hate 6-ft tall mice in suspenders.

PMSNBC wrote:

The hacker group Anonymous on Monday declared war against the city of Orlando, Florida, over the arrest of people handing out food to homeless people, according to a report in The Washington Post.

In a press release, the group announced the creation of "Operation Orlando" over the city's treatment of the Food Not Bombs group.

The Orlando Sentinel reported that what started as a spat over distributing food without a permit in a park had escalated, with Mayor Buddy Dyer describing the activists charged with the misdemeanor offense as "food terrorists."
Anonymous seizes Tunisian government site

This prompted one member, Ben Markeson, to threaten to file a defamation suit, the Sentinel reported.

The Anonymous press release said the city had "ignored our warnings, and our generous offer of a cease fire."

'Human rights abusers'
"On Wednesday last you not only arrested two more people for feeding but you arrested the worldwide President of Food Not Bombs Keith McHenry. This is a declaration of war," it said.

"Henceforth there will be no more cease fires, no more attempts to get you to resolve this issue with human decency. We will now treat you like the human rights abusers that you are," it added.
And it's already started, apparently:

https://i.imgur.com/3CTKe.jpg

About the arrest & statute in question:

The group lost a court battle in April, clearing the way for the city to enforce the ordinance. It requires groups to obtain a permit and limits each group to two permits per year for each park within a 2-mile radius of City Hall.

Arrest papers state that Cross, Markeson and McHenry helped feed 40 people Wednesday night. The ordinance applies to feedings of more than 25 people.

Police waited until everyone was served to make the arrests, said Douglas Coleman, speaking for Orlando Food Not Bombs.

"They basically carted them off to jail for feeding hungry people," said Coleman, who was not present. "For them to regulate a time and place for free speech and to share food, that is unacceptable."

Orlando Food Not Bombs has been feeding the homeless breakfast on Mondays for several years and dinner on Wednesdays for five years.

Police had not enforced the ordinance while the court battle continued. The U.S. District Court of Appeals for the 11th Circuit in Atlanta ruled that city rules regulating how often large groups of people can be fed in a park do not violate the Constitution.

The penalty for violating Orlando's ordinance is 60 days in jail, a $500 fine or both.

Arrest documents state that Orlando Food Not Bombs received permits and fed more than 25 homeless people at Lake Eola Park on May 18 and 23. Coleman said the group rejected the permits.

On May 25, Orlando Food Not Bombs illegally fed a large group of homeless people, the police report states. The group on its website called for members to show up that day and defy the city ordinance, according to the report.

Officers said they found a press release on Markeson when they arrested him stating that group members planned to defy the ordinance Wednesday.
Orlando Food Not Bombs lost a court battle on the Constitutionality of the permit requirement 10-0 in April at the 11th District Court of Appeals in Atlanta. One would think the issue was dead at that point. Not so. They filed for the requisite permit to carry on their activities and received it...then rejected it (as reflected above) in order to protest something that had already been decided 10-0 in an appellate court.

So they had received the required permit, rejected it, advertised for people to come in defiance of the permit they had received (and rejected), and then protest when they are arrested (after serving the food to the homeless, btw) for not having the permit they were offered and then rejected? And then Anonymous is going to attack Orlando's municipal websites because of it?

How are they helping feed homeless people by getting themselves locked up? It's not like they aren't getting the permit that is required to do what they need to do. It's not like Orlando is preventing them from feeding the homeless (as they charge). They are preventing themselves from doing so, it would appear.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

"On May 25, Orlando Food Not Bombs illegally fed a large group of homeless people"

illegally fed homeless people? it's sickening that there are laws against feeding the starving.
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

AussieReaper wrote:

"On May 25, Orlando Food Not Bombs illegally fed a large group of homeless people"

illegally fed homeless people? it's sickening that there are laws against feeding the starving.
Read everything first, AR.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

FEOS wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

"On May 25, Orlando Food Not Bombs illegally fed a large group of homeless people"

illegally fed homeless people? it's sickening that there are laws against feeding the starving.
Read everything first, AR.
I did. And rejected or not, why do you have to apply for a permit?
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

"On May 25, Orlando Food Not Bombs illegally fed a large group of homeless people"

illegally fed homeless people? it's sickening that there are laws against feeding the starving.
Read everything first, AR.
I did. And rejected or not, why do you have to apply for a permit?
Not sure. That's certainly a point up for debate, as it's not required in other cities (San Francisco, for instance). I wasn't able to find a reason for the statute, nor whether it's applicable only to homeless groups or just to giving out free food or whatever.

However, if there is a process for them to do this legally, and they obtained the proper permits to do so, then rejected said permits...their arrest is on their own shoulders, is it not? Particularly if their challenge was essentially slam-dunked back in their faces at the next level.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

FEOS wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:


Read everything first, AR.
I did. And rejected or not, why do you have to apply for a permit?
Not sure. That's certainly a point up for debate, as it's not required in other cities (San Francisco, for instance). I wasn't able to find a reason for the statute, nor whether it's applicable only to homeless groups or just to giving out free food or whatever.

However, if there is a process for them to do this legally, and they obtained the proper permits to do so, then rejected said permits...their arrest is on their own shoulders, is it not? Particularly if their challenge was essentially slam-dunked back in their faces at the next level.
So you're not sure why you need a permit, yet you feel the group should not protest the need for one because the city says so? Ok...

On the ordinance:

The group lost a court battle in April, clearing the way for the city to enforce the ordinance. It requires groups to obtain a permit and limits each group to two permits per year for each park within a 2-mile radius of City Hall.

Arrest papers state that Cross, Markeson and McHenry helped feed 40 people Wednesday night. The ordinance applies to feedings of more than 25 people.

So you're basically allowed to feed 24 people. 25 and suddenly an ordinance applies. You're allowed 2 permits per year for each park within a 2mile radius of town hall.

To feed the starving.

That is madness. I wonder if requesting/owning a permit costs any money. Charities like this should be encouraged, not arrested.
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6840|132 and Bush

FEOS wrote:

How are they helping feed homeless people by getting themselves locked up? .
Because it's an activist group.
From their site "Because Capitalism makes food a source of Profit not a source of nutrition".

why do you have to apply for a permit?
Everyone who serves food to the public (more than 25 people at one time) needs a permit. Food and health safety.

Orlando has several groups that legally serve food to the homeless downtown. If you think this is just about feeding the hungry you're mistaken.




also.. "Orlando Food Not Bombs shares vegan and vegetarian food with hungry people in the Orlando area."
fu
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6914|Canberra, AUS
Sounds as much a missionary group than a charity.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

Spark wrote:

Sounds as much a missionary group than a charity.
It's just a bunch of hippies, really.

https://i.imgur.com/OEmlN.jpg
http://www.orlandofoodnotbombs.org/


Why would the police arrest these guys:

https://i.imgur.com/h9N4Y.jpg

unless they actually had reason to suspect food/safety was at risk? Are the permits that heavily enforced?
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

Kmar wrote:

why do you have to apply for a permit?
Everyone who serves food to the public (more than 25 people at one time) needs a permit. Food and health safety.

Orlando has several groups that legally serve food to the homeless downtown. If you think this is just about feeding the hungry you're mistaken.




also.. "Orlando Food Not Bombs shares vegan and vegetarian food with hungry people in the Orlando area."
fu
The food and health safety issue is important. FNB "repatriates" much of their food from dumpsters after it's been thrown out by restaurants and grocers. Granted, it's often not spoiled, but they're still pulling food they then feed to people from dumpsters.

And AR, I'm not arguing that the statute in question makes sense (except from a food safety perspective). The numbers limit certainly doesn't. However, the actions of the group do not. Getting a permit, then rejecting it, then getting pissed because they got arrested for not having the very permit they were previously given (and rejected)...it's nonsense. And Anonymous then attacking Orlando's municipal systems because FNB pulled such a nonsensical stunt certainly makes their hactivism even more unseemly.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

I've heard some Orlando-area people's views on the issue on the radio. Would be interesting to hear Kmar's views...
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6840|132 and Bush

AussieReaper wrote:

Are the permits that heavily enforced?
Food permits are. Anything that has to do with public health is.

As I said before, there are plenty of other organizations that feed the homeless without issue in Orlando. If FNB wanted to be amongst those allowed to serve the hungry they could be. They were even given permits.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

FEOS wrote:

The food and health safety issue is important. FNB "repatriates" much of their food from dumpsters after it's been thrown out by restaurants and grocers. Granted, it's often not spoiled, but they're still pulling food they then feed to people from dumpsters.
Where are you getting that info from? And where do you think the homeless are likely to get food from without charity? I'll give you a hint - from dumpsters.

FEOS wrote:

And AR, I'm not arguing that the statute in question makes sense (except from a food safety perspective). The numbers limit certainly doesn't. However, the actions of the group do not. Getting a permit, then rejecting it, then getting pissed because they got arrested for not having the very permit they were previously given (and rejected)...it's nonsense. And Anonymous then attacking Orlando's municipal systems because FNB pulled such a nonsensical stunt certainly makes their hactivism even more unseemly.
If there was a suspicion that this group were handing out spoiled food, then fine investigate. Prosecute if necessary. I've no problem with that at all. But to arrest because they don't hold a permit is pathetic.
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Jaekus
I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose
+957|5418|Sydney
Land of the free

Seriously though, aren't police resources better used than to arrest people for feeding the homeless? It seems a pretty heavy handed approach to what is basically charity.
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

The food and health safety issue is important. FNB "repatriates" much of their food from dumpsters after it's been thrown out by restaurants and grocers. Granted, it's often not spoiled, but they're still pulling food they then feed to people from dumpsters.
Where are you getting that info from? And where do you think the homeless are likely to get food from without charity? I'll give you a hint - from dumpsters.
We have food banks and plenty of other sources that don't involve dumpsters.

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

And AR, I'm not arguing that the statute in question makes sense (except from a food safety perspective). The numbers limit certainly doesn't. However, the actions of the group do not. Getting a permit, then rejecting it, then getting pissed because they got arrested for not having the very permit they were previously given (and rejected)...it's nonsense. And Anonymous then attacking Orlando's municipal systems because FNB pulled such a nonsensical stunt certainly makes their hactivism even more unseemly.
If there was a suspicion that this group were handing out spoiled food, then fine investigate. Prosecute if necessary. I've no problem with that at all. But to arrest because they don't hold a permit is pathetic.
They were given a permit, but rejected it. It was a conscious decision and action on their part. How could the police not act if they knew a violation was going to occur at a given time and place?
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6840|132 and Bush

Jaekus wrote:

Land of the free

Seriously though, aren't police resources better used than to arrest people for feeding the homeless? It seems a pretty heavy handed approach to what is basically charity.
They really forced the police dept's hand by calling attention to themselves. The police even made sure everyone was fed before making the arrest. I mean it's not like they don't care. This was more of a protest than a feeding.

If you want to know what some of the questions are on a Group Feeding permit ..
  • Describe how and where all foods on the menu will be stored, prepared, transported, cooked, and served at the event. No extensivefood preparation may be done onsite at the events. All foods must be prepared before the event at a licensed commissary. Only final foodassembly, cooking, and serving at the event will be allowed.
  • List equipment and describe facilities that will be used at the temporary food establishment. All temporary food establishments musthave adequate cooking, hot holding (>135F), and refrigeration facilities (<41F).
  • Describe how hands will be washed.
  • How will wastewater and garbage be disposed?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6651|'Murka

Kmar wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

Land of the free

Seriously though, aren't police resources better used than to arrest people for feeding the homeless? It seems a pretty heavy handed approach to what is basically charity.
They really forced the police dept's hand by calling attention to themselves. The police even made sure everyone was fed before making the arrest. I mean it's not like they don't care. This was more of a protest than a feeding.

If you want to know what some of the questions are on a Group Feeding permit ..
  • Describe how and where all foods on the menu will be stored, prepared, transported, cooked, and served at the event. No extensivefood preparation may be done onsite at the events. All foods must be prepared before the event at a licensed commissary. Only final foodassembly, cooking, and serving at the event will be allowed.
  • List equipment and describe facilities that will be used at the temporary food establishment. All temporary food establishments musthave adequate cooking, hot holding (>135F), and refrigeration facilities (<41F).
  • Describe how hands will be washed.
  • How will wastewater and garbage be disposed?
Fucking fascists!
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6840|132 and Bush

FEOS wrote:

We have food banks and plenty of other sources that don't involve dumpsters.
.. and that's the point of having such food organizations. To serve them healthy food as an alternative to dumpster diving.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
jsnipy
...
+3,277|6762|...

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

"On May 25, Orlando Food Not Bombs illegally fed a large group of homeless people"

illegally fed homeless people? it's sickening that there are laws against feeding the starving.
Read everything first, AR.
I did. And rejected or not, why do you have to apply for a permit?
if they are serving prepared food they probably need something close to what a restaurant would get (to put them in the queue for health inspections)
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

FEOS wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

The food and health safety issue is important. FNB "repatriates" much of their food from dumpsters after it's been thrown out by restaurants and grocers. Granted, it's often not spoiled, but they're still pulling food they then feed to people from dumpsters.
Where are you getting that info from? And where do you think the homeless are likely to get food from without charity? I'll give you a hint - from dumpsters.
We have food banks and plenty of other sources that don't involve dumpsters.

AussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

And AR, I'm not arguing that the statute in question makes sense (except from a food safety perspective). The numbers limit certainly doesn't. However, the actions of the group do not. Getting a permit, then rejecting it, then getting pissed because they got arrested for not having the very permit they were previously given (and rejected)...it's nonsense. And Anonymous then attacking Orlando's municipal systems because FNB pulled such a nonsensical stunt certainly makes their hactivism even more unseemly.
If there was a suspicion that this group were handing out spoiled food, then fine investigate. Prosecute if necessary. I've no problem with that at all. But to arrest because they don't hold a permit is pathetic.
They were given a permit, but rejected it. It was a conscious decision and action on their part. How could the police not act if they knew a violation was going to occur at a given time and place?
Where did you get the info that states

FNB "repatriates" much of their food from dumpsters after it's been thrown out by restaurants and grocers

?
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6840|132 and Bush

I think they were counting on not getting the permit. They had encounters with the police before. When they got the permit they were probably like .. oh shit.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5598|London, England
You guys are giving this more attention that it deserves. They wanted to be arrested for the publicity... so don't give them any.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6840|132 and Bush

Jay wrote:

You guys are giving this more attention that it deserves. They wanted to be arrested for the publicity... so don't give them any.
But if that attention results in accentuating their egotism and stupidity why not highlight it? We just need to count on people getting beyond the sensationalistic "The man wants people to starve" headline.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6392|what

Kmar wrote:

We just need to count on people getting beyond the sensationalistic "The man wants people to starve" headline.
You could say the same for "Anonymous" Declares War on Orlando
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Varegg
Support fanatic :-)
+2,206|7050|Nårvei

Can't be that hard to follow a simple rule like that, I'm sure every civilized country have food & health rules similar to this ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................

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