Iraq veteran another casualty of a different war

2011-05-15 11:08:02

#1

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/a … f8301.html

The Pima County Regional SWAT team fired 71 shots in seven seconds at a Tucson man they say pointed a gun at officers serving a search warrant at his home.
Jose Guerena, 26, a former Marine who served in Iraq twice, was holding an AR-15 rifle when he was killed, but he never fired a shot, the Sheriff's Department said Monday after initially saying he had fired on officers during last week's raid.

...

There were no sirens or shouts of "police," she said.
Guerena told his wife and son to hide inside a closet and he grabbed the AR-15 rifle, his wife said.
The department says SWAT members were clear when identifying themselves while entering the home.

hah, yeah right, they'll say anything to clear themselves of wrongdoing

...

Guerena says there were no drugs in their house.
Deputies said they seized a "large sum of money from another house" that morning. But they refused to say from which of the homes searched that morning they found narcotics, drug ledgers or drug paraphernalia. Court documents showing what was being sought and was found have not been made public. A computer check on Guerena revealed a couple of traffic tickets and no criminal history.

He didn't fire a single bullet at them:

http://www.kvoa.com/news/pcso-swat-inci … -deputies/

What kind of warrant could they possibly have been serving that required what really amounts to a military assault on the house of an ordinary citizen? I'll eat my hat if it WASN'T a drug-related warrant.

e: seems it was drugs, and they actually kept EMTs from entering the home for an hour

http://www.kgun9.com/story/14629829/med … ed-by-swat

End the War on Drugs NOW.

Last edited by Hurricane2k9 (2011-05-15 11:10:04)

https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/36793/marylandsig.jpg

2011-05-15 11:20:36

#2

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5618|London, England

End SWAT teams now.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2011-05-15 11:24:14

#3

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

Jay wrote:
End SWAT teams now.

cannot tell if srs

2011-05-15 11:30:01

#4

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5618|London, England

Hurricane2k9 wrote:
Jay wrote:
End SWAT teams now.
cannot tell if srs

Totally serious. Cities spend tens of millions of dollars training up these paramilitary assault squads and they have to justify that money spent so they use them to serve warrants like here. Remember that video of a SWAT team raiding a food coop a few months ago? Yeah, the cause that day? The coop was selling unpasteurized milk. Heaven forbid!

If you need paramilitary types to perform a raid, you better have ridiculously solid intelligence, and you should call in the FBI or something to conduct it. Hell, contract out to Delta Force or something. I respect the law, I really do, but I don't see why I should live in fear of cops busting down my door with guns drawn because someone may have given them a false tip.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2011-05-15 11:37:14

#5

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

I have no problem with SWAT teams dealing with things like bank robberies. But I do agree that their use should be incredibly limited.

And now in Indiana their supreme court ruled that you CANNOT resist, through force at least, any unlawful entry into your home by police.

Franklin was right.

Last edited by Hurricane2k9 (2011-05-15 11:37:23)

2011-05-15 11:41:59

#6

eleven bravo: Member; +1,399|5519|foggy bottom

Jay wrote:
Hurricane2k9 wrote:
Jay wrote:
End SWAT teams now.
cannot tell if srs
Totally serious. Cities spend tens of millions of dollars training up these paramilitary assault squads and they have to justify that money spent so they use them to serve warrants like here. Remember that video of a SWAT team raiding a food coop a few months ago? Yeah, the cause that day? The coop was selling unpasteurized milk. Heaven forbid!

If you need paramilitary types to perform a raid, you better have ridiculously solid intelligence, and you should call in the FBI or something to conduct it. Hell, contract out to Delta Force or something. I respect the law, I really do, but I don't see why I should live in fear of cops busting down my door with guns drawn because someone may have given them a false tip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Q7ENXEAy0I

contact the fbi? doesnt that conflict with your small government mantra?

Tu Stultus Es

2011-05-15 11:54:57

#7

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5618|London, England

eleven bravo wrote:
Jay wrote:
Hurricane2k9 wrote:

cannot tell if srs
Totally serious. Cities spend tens of millions of dollars training up these paramilitary assault squads and they have to justify that money spent so they use them to serve warrants like here. Remember that video of a SWAT team raiding a food coop a few months ago? Yeah, the cause that day? The coop was selling unpasteurized milk. Heaven forbid!

If you need paramilitary types to perform a raid, you better have ridiculously solid intelligence, and you should call in the FBI or something to conduct it. Hell, contract out to Delta Force or something. I respect the law, I really do, but I don't see why I should live in fear of cops busting down my door with guns drawn because someone may have given them a false tip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Q7ENXEAy0I
contact the fbi? doesnt that conflict with your small government mantra?

If we're paying for the fbi anyway, why have overlapping jurisdictions and crap? Let them be the heavily trained heavy hitters.

Fucking 9/11 did this to us. The Feds dumped so many billions of dollars into local law enforcement that now every bumfuck small city seems to have an expensive SWAT team with all the latest gadgetry. It's not going away either. Most of those cops are military police weekend warriors who dream of hanging with the big boys in Special Forces and shit. They get off on it. We don't need the macho bullshit army crap transferred over into every day civilian life.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2011-05-15 12:03:45

#8

KEN-JENNINGS: I am all that is MOD!; +2,979|6892|949

some of the gung-ho swat teams were a knee-jerk reaction to the north hollywood bank robbery and subsequent shoot out

2011-05-15 12:04:16

#9

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5618|London, England

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:
some of the gung-ho swat teams were a knee-jerk reaction to the north hollywood bank robbery and subsequent shoot out

Yep. That too.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2011-05-15 14:28:01

#10

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6705|The Land of Scott Walker

Hear a noise, hide your family, and grab your weapon. Sounds pretty reasonable to me. Especially if what the wife says is true about no sirens or announcement of police. I was minding my own business on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago and ended up getting slammed on the hood of an unmarked squad and cuffed before anyone announced police.

2011-05-15 14:29:50

#11

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

Stingray24 wrote:
Hear a noise, hide your family, and grab your weapon. Sounds pretty reasonable to me. Especially if what the wife says is true about no sirens or announcement of police. I was minding my own business on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago and ended up getting slammed on the hood of an unmarked squad and cuffed before anyone announced police.

And in Indiana, you'd be in the wrong for doing so.

Welcome to the new America, please proceed to the left for your barcode tattoo and tracking device!

2011-05-15 15:39:06

#12

rdx-fx: ...; +955|6851

Stingray24 wrote:
I was minding my own business on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago and ended up getting slammed on the hood of an unmarked squad and cuffed before anyone announced police.

Ah, Chicago PD.
Where they point guns at your head, with their finger on the trigger, for a routine traffic stop.
One at my car window, gun in hand - the other aiming at my head, through my back window, over/through my daughter's car seat.

My offense?

I was driving a car that was the same make as one that'd allegedly caused property damage the night before.
License plate from a different state on my car, different color, different model and body style, and a toddler car-seat in the back..
but, still... "gud 'nuff 'scuse to draw down onna perp" for fucking officer Gomer and his partner, Cleetus.

Last edited by rdx-fx (2011-05-15 15:46:22)

2011-05-15 15:48:16

#13

-Sh1fty-: plundering yee booty; +510|5734|Ventura, California

I hate cops like that.

And above your tomb, the stars will belong to us.

2011-05-15 15:58:20

#14

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

rdx-fx wrote:
Stingray24 wrote:
I was minding my own business on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago and ended up getting slammed on the hood of an unmarked squad and cuffed before anyone announced police.
Ah, Chicago PD.
Where they point guns at your head, with their finger on the trigger, for a routine traffic stop.
One at my car window, gun in hand - the other aiming at my head, through my back window, over/through my daughter's car seat.

My offense?

I was driving a car that was the same make as one that'd allegedly caused property damage the night before.
License plate from a different state on my car, different color, different model and body style, and a toddler car-seat in the back..
but, still... "gud 'nuff 'scuse to draw down onna perp" for fucking officer Gomer and his partner, Cleetus.

chicago is true paradise

2011-05-15 16:46:44

#15

Trotskygrad: бля; +354|6259|Vortex Ring State

rdx-fx wrote:
Stingray24 wrote:
I was minding my own business on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago and ended up getting slammed on the hood of an unmarked squad and cuffed before anyone announced police.
Ah, Chicago PD.
Where they point guns at your head, with their finger on the trigger, for a routine traffic stop.
One at my car window, gun in hand - the other aiming at my head, through my back window, over/through my daughter's car seat.

My offense?

I was driving a car that was the same make as one that'd allegedly caused property damage the night before.
License plate from a different state on my car, different color, different model and body style, and a toddler car-seat in the back..
but, still... "gud 'nuff 'scuse to draw down onna perp" for fucking officer Gomer and his partner, Cleetus.

chicago fuck yeah

police drive you half way across the city then drop you off so you know not to fuck with them

2011-05-15 16:49:41

#16

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5618|London, England

Cops here just shoot black immigrants.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2011-05-15 17:32:45

#17

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

Cops here are OK, the real issue is with the government. All the people on the city council don't wanna upset the black people who vote them in by being tough on crime, especially youth crime (because it's always someone's son or nephew or grandkid). The DYRS (Dept of Youth Rehab Services) is a fucking joke and a revolving door.

Similar issues in Maryland as well. I like my state and DC for the most part but sometimes I want to move to Virginia.

2011-05-15 17:37:00

#18

FEOS: Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate; +1,182|6671|'Murka

Hurricane2k9 wrote:
Cops here are OK, the real issue is with the government. All the people on the city council don't wanna upset the black people who vote them in by being tough on crime, especially youth crime (because it's always someone's son or nephew or grandkid). The DYRS (Dept of Youth Rehab Services) is a fucking joke and a revolving door.

Similar issues in Maryland as well. I like my state and DC for the most part but sometimes I want to move to Virginia.

DC govt is a fucking joke. Ex: Marion Barry.

“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular

2011-05-15 18:19:50

#19

Stingray24: Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy; +1,060|6705|The Land of Scott Walker

rdx-fx wrote:
Stingray24 wrote:
I was minding my own business on Lakeshore Drive in Chicago and ended up getting slammed on the hood of an unmarked squad and cuffed before anyone announced police.
Ah, Chicago PD.
Where they point guns at your head, with their finger on the trigger, for a routine traffic stop.
One at my car window, gun in hand - the other aiming at my head, through my back window, over/through my daughter's car seat.

My offense?

I was driving a car that was the same make as one that'd allegedly caused property damage the night before.
License plate from a different state on my car, different color, different model and body style, and a toddler car-seat in the back..
but, still... "gud 'nuff 'scuse to draw down onna perp" for fucking officer Gomer and his partner, Cleetus.

Their excuse was there is a lot of gang activity in the area. Guess my girlfriend and 4 friends must have looked suspicious running in and out of the surf while strolling along the beach. Perhaps my relaxed fit jeans were slightly too baggy. I didn't know I was being approached by the police til I was hurtling towards the hood of the unmarked car. Tried to get their badge numbers but they were conveniently hidden away from sight.

2011-05-15 20:33:22

#20

Hurricane2k9: Pendulous Sweaty Balls; +1,538|5962|College Park, MD

FEOS wrote:
Hurricane2k9 wrote:
Cops here are OK, the real issue is with the government. All the people on the city council don't wanna upset the black people who vote them in by being tough on crime, especially youth crime (because it's always someone's son or nephew or grandkid). The DYRS (Dept of Youth Rehab Services) is a fucking joke and a revolving door.

Similar issues in Maryland as well. I like my state and DC for the most part but sometimes I want to move to Virginia.
DC govt is a fucking joke. Ex: Marion Barry.

Things were improving under Fenty, but then he got the boot in exchange for Gray under the premise that he'd still improve the city, but including everyone from every ward. He's only been in office for a few months so it's hard to make a call, but we've already had a few corruption scandals. Guess it's back to 'bidness' as usual.

2011-05-15 20:42:05

#21

cpt.fass1: The Cap'n Can Make it Hap'n; +329|6956|NJ

Ehh it's the same every where. If this wasn't a veteran there'd be no care.

2011-05-15 20:44:12

#22

krazed: Admiral of the Bathtub; +619|7040|Great Brown North

inb4cheerleaders

it would not surprise me AT ALL if they didn't announce anything before knocking the door in

2011-05-15 21:06:33

#23

Ty: Mass Media Casualty; +2,398|7035|Noizyland

Clearly the SWAT team was in the wrong but I would like to point out that reasonable response or not, if this guy hadn't had an AR-15 he wouldn't have been shot.

Or at least most likely wouldn't have been. Judging by some cop stories its hard to tell. Given the amount of training those SWAT team guys receive you would have thought someone would have told them that using deadly force is a last resort. Hell this is what we're told in the NZ Army and these guys are cops, it's not like they're at war wth anyone here.

[Blinking eyes thing]
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/tzyon

2011-05-15 21:12:32

#24

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5846

The cops were in the right to shoot the guy if he had an AR-15. Further more, you can't blame the police for doing what they were trained and drilled to do.

The real blame lies with the people who authorized the raid and who made enforcing (on that level) drugs laws a priority.

2011-05-15 21:18:40

#25

krazed: Admiral of the Bathtub; +619|7040|Great Brown North

cops have shot people for holding a remote, a wallet, garage door opener, cell phone, playstation controller, flip flops, and last but not least, NOTHING in their hands at all

we can blame the police on the scene for not announcing (if they didn't)

BF2S Forums Iraq veteran another casualty of a different war

Jay wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Jay wrote:

Jay wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Jay wrote:

eleven bravo wrote:

Jay wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

rdx-fx wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

rdx-fx wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

rdx-fx wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

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