DAST Chat

2022-02-22 23:18:30

#16451

uziq: Member; +496|3695

i said there wouldn’t be a ww3, and there won’t. the NATO countries have said from the start they aren’t going to engage in any combat. which they won’t.

‘recognising’ two tiny enclaves which have been in de facto control of russian separatists for the last 8 years isn’t quite yet ‘rolling across europe’.

it will be a surprising turn of events if he presses on to kyiv and takes ukraine. i’ll give you that. but still very, very far away from your usual overheated tripe. ‘china are going to takeover the world, they want world domination’. ‘putin is going to roll across europe’. ok dilbert. there there.

2022-02-22 23:25:59

#16452

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6349|eXtreme to the maX

They're pretty large enclaves, and Putin has recognised the halves which aren't under separatist control - a simple grab.

They add up to 1/5 of the area of the UK, hardly 'tiny'.

Fuck Israel

2022-02-22 23:41:25

#16453

uziq: Member; +496|3695

i don’t know since when the size of land gains has to be measured in comparison to the size of the UK.

let’s be clear: any move he has made in that direction is a contravention of the minsk accords and an act of total unilateral aggression from a legal-diplomatic point of view. his ranting about ukrainian history makes it clear that he’s going way off piste in this regard.

but they are tiny enclaves relative to ukraine’s land mass and nation. the total population affected is about 3.5 million people out of a total population of 48 million.

https://ponderwall.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/2014_pro-Russian_unrest_in_Ukraine.jpg

the actual areas concerned at the moment are technically smaller than the shaded regions, as not all of the claimed areas have been in separatist control. it remains to be seen how fierce the fighting will be over these breakaway regions borders.

considering you were talking about ‘putin rolling across europe’, these facts are rather inconvenient to your hysterical rhetoric. a ‘land grab’, unquestionably yes. i said that earlier in this thread and have referred to it thus all along. but would it have been right to talk about the annexation of crimea as ‘putin rolling across europe’? ehmmm. there there dilbert.

if you’re going to accuse me of being flat out wrong, some detail is important, mr. 6 million ww2 dead.

Last edited by uziq (2022-02-22 23:44:12)

2022-02-22 23:42:12

#16454

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|7015|PNW

Off topic but your whole country is a land grab, dilbs. Mine is too.

2022-02-22 23:45:40

#16455

uziq: Member; +496|3695

that’s really unhelpfully off topic.

you’re echoing the talking points of tucker carlson, trump, et al, and the parts of the loony american right who seem determined to find the best in everything putin does.

ukraine has a been a culture and a people for longer than muscovite russia. putin doesn’t get to make vague and shady appeals to history in that way.

Last edited by uziq (2022-02-22 23:46:31)

2022-02-23 02:34:23

#16456

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6349|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:
the actual areas concerned at the moment are technically smaller than the shaded regions, as not all of the claimed areas have been in separatist control.

As I understand it Putin has claimed the entire shaded regions, not just the areas under separatist control.

Also saw I think the UKR Foreign Minister pointing out that Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons in return for Europe and Russia agreeing that its borders would be protected.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_ … Assurances

That was a bad deal, should have taken NATO membership as part of that one, now the UNSC should step in - fat lot of use they are.

Fuck Israel

2022-02-23 02:35:23

#16457

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6349|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:
Off topic but your whole country is a land grab, dilbs. Mine is too.

And since the UN was created land grabs are not acceptable.

Except for Israel, they can grab all the land they want.

Fuck Israel

2022-02-23 02:39:24

#16458

uziq: Member; +496|3695

Dilbert_X wrote:
uziq wrote:
the actual areas concerned at the moment are technically smaller than the shaded regions, as not all of the claimed areas have been in separatist control.
As I understand it Putin has claimed the entire shaded regions, not just the areas under separatist control.

Also saw I think the UKR Foreign Minister pointing out that Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons in return for Europe and Russia agreeing that its borders would be protected.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_ … Assurances

That was a bad deal, should have taken NATO membership as part of that one, now the UNSC should step in - fat lot of use they are.

lmao yes, well done, quite a hot take. 'ukraine shouldn't have given away its nukes'.

this has literally been a talking point in ukraine and ukrainian nationalist politics for, erm, the last 25 years at least. you're really keeping up with your reading, dilbert!

at the fall of the USSR ukraine had a pretty good claim to a huge chunk of the russian nuclear arsenal, as well obviously as the russian navy's fleet ports, etc. that's a large part of the entire reason for russia's geopolitical ambitions in the region.

it's an incredibly hot take, a radioactive take, you could say, to claim that the best course of action would have been for a brand new infant democracy to have one of the world's largest nuclear arsenals. or to argue that any country, really, should be invested in nuclear armament.

besides, it was the early 1990s, the era of 'end of history', end-of-Cold War triumphalism, russia was a madhat capitalist experiment and had seemingly sloughed off all of its axis of evil ideology overnight. denuclearisation of any geopolitically hot regions is generally a laudable aim, imo. would it change the balance of power now? erm, probably not? it's not like even a nuke-armed ukraine would have used the things over crimea. this entire region has nightmarish memories of nuclear spillover already.

Last edited by uziq (2022-02-23 02:42:10)

2022-02-23 02:44:06

#16459

Larssen: Member; +99|2131

The unsc includes russia as a permanent member who can/will/have vetoed all proposed resolutions wrt ukraine.

And yes, the entire region has been claimed. The ukrainian military holds fortified defensive positions along the borders of the current separatist/russian controlled areas. This means the russian military is very likely to start an offensive to remove the ukrainian presence from the entire region, somewhere in the coming days.

This may also involve missile and bombing campaigns on the rest of ukraine, depending on how heated the conflict will get. The independence recognition and the following 'peace operation' is a soft declaration of war.

My info indicates that the russian occupation/annexation will likely be limited to the donbas area. That's all I'll write. We'll see, but that seems expected considering various factors.

Last edited by Larssen (2022-02-23 02:48:49)

2022-02-23 02:47:55

#16460

uziq: Member; +496|3695

which is literally why i said

the actual areas concerned at the moment are technically smaller than the shaded regions, as not all of the claimed areas have been in separatist control. it remains to be seen how fierce the fighting will be over these breakaway regions borders.

and, in any case, we are a very fucking long way from 'putin will roll his tanks through europe', part of dilbert's usual paranoiac tirades about china conquering the world, russia causing the fall of europe, etc.

it's a huge crisis, no doubt, but i don't know what use this 'putin rolling tanks through europe' rhetoric has.

Dilbert_X wrote:
So anyway, where's the post where I said Putin could sweep across Europe again and uziq ridiculed me?

errrrm yeah .... no.

2022-02-23 04:43:33

#16461

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +641|3963

After the Iraq War I find it difficult to call out countries for starting their own silly wars of aggression.

2022-02-23 04:56:01

#16462

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|7015|PNW

Dilbert_X wrote:
unnamednewbie13 wrote:
Off topic but your whole country is a land grab, dilbs. Mine is too.
And since the UN was created land grabs are not acceptable.

Except for Israel, they can grab all the land they want.

We do land grabs in smaller chunks now. The wealthy snap up properties everywhere and price everyone else out of affordable housing. I have watched homes get flipped (read: "fresh-coat-of-paint" repairs, lol) for double, triple, quadruple+ their 80s prices for the past 30 years. Places near where I lived then have had a figure added, and in another 10-20 years could easily have a second on top of that and be in worse condition than ever before.

Where's the UN to protect us from ourselves?

2022-02-23 05:31:54

#16463

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +641|3963

High home prices are a sign of a good economy /Fox New Business Channel

2022-02-23 05:58:51

#16464

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +641|3963

Women healthcare products should be free.

Last edited by SuperJail Warden (2022-02-23 06:54:56)

2022-02-24 00:49:08

#16465

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6349|eXtreme to the maX

In Putin's 'Downfall' parody TV address he looked unhinged, apparently he's been in covid isolation for the last two years and it may have got to him.

Maybe if the Russian vaccines worked this wouldn't have happened.

Here's hoping covid wipes them out.

Holy shitballs

https://i.imgur.com/OysAGyw.mp4

https://i.imgur.com/ZnNWDi7.mp4

Fuck Israel

2022-02-24 00:53:19

#16466

uziq: Member; +496|3695

it's pretty odd that russia and china have both totally skipped mRNA vaccines. and even in their regular vaccine tech, they have singularly failed to produce an effective vaccine.

cuba tasked its own health system with developing vaccines and came up with, afaik, 3/4 working ones in a short order.

2.5 years into a pandemic and its like russia/china have squandered every opportunity. very bizarre.

but remember: china should be looked to as an example. it's totally sensible to skip highly effective vaccines and lock down 40 million people for months on end!

dilbert: vaccines might one day have an unintended side-effect. we should use lockdowns and closures.
also dilbert: puTiN iS crAzy. hE beeN in LockDown ToOoOo lOng!!!!

Last edited by uziq (2022-02-24 00:54:25)

2022-02-24 01:00:46

#16467

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6349|eXtreme to the maX

Lockdowns and closures are sensible measures.

Anyway

There's a whole load of shady shit to come out, US govt officials are openly questioning Britain's limp sanctions - as of yesterday - and saying the tories must be under the thumb of Russia

I'd put all the oligarchs in London under house arrest and seize their assets - no compensation.
The can take Chelsea FC with them though.

Fuck Israel

2022-02-24 01:07:05

#16468

uziq: Member; +496|3695

this has been written about and reported on for years. ‘shady shit coming out’ LMAO. hawkish thinktanks and political quangos have been writing about the infiltration of russian money into the UK/US for most of the last decade.

no shit it’s majorly compromising for johnson’s current iteration of the conservative party in particular. the money goes deep.

the last defence minister, a useless oik gavin williamson, infamously said in an interview that the ‘russians should go away’, and then the next day took lunch with a russian woman connected to their own defence/interior ministry. she paid him like £60,000 for his time. no idea what she wanted or the purposes of that meeting.

boris as foreign secretary was filmed limping home on a budget flight from his russian oligarch’s italian party palace on more than one occasion. the same oligarch that johnson recently put into the house of lords as a thanks for his years of funding/patronage.

2022-03-02 17:54:16

#16469

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +641|3963

Raising Crosswalks to Make Deadly Intersections Safer in New York
City officials want to install 100 raised crosswalks every year as part of a larger effort to redesign dangerous intersections.

Huge undertaking but awesome. The other thing we need to do is now start a giant flood tunnel program
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunnel_and_Reservoir_Plan

2022-03-02 18:04:31

#16470

uziq: Member; +496|3695

raises crosswalks are very much still in the paradigm of cities built around cars. routing pedestrians around the necessary cars’ domain. we had cities built like that in the 1970s. it was supposed to be ‘futurism’ and the urbanism of the future. birmingham in the UK has an awful lot of raised concrete crosswalks or underpasses. they are generally considered to be dangerous and unsightly spaces.

the real step forward is no emissions zones, cycle paths, and getting rid of private vehicles in city centres altogether.

don’t, errr, chicago and minneapolis also have lots of raised crosswalks, on account of the weather? in a similar 1970s jetsons vibe?

Last edited by uziq (2022-03-02 18:07:20)

2022-03-02 18:19:31

#16471

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|7015|PNW

Raised sidewalks make sense for a municipality completely uninterested in reducing the necessity of vehicular traffic. I would personally be happy with safer bike paths. My town has a lot of jury-rigged bicycle lanes with the stencil, but no delineation. Also very dangerous points of conflict where the bike lane cuts left across a right hand turn lane. Ride with the flow of traffic - great, now I can't see who's coming up behind me. I'll stick to the sidewalk thanks, and hop off of my bike on the insanely rare occasion I actually encounter a pedestrian outside of the school commute.

2022-03-02 18:28:18