Its lowing's point, that Israel can never make a deal because the neighbouring countries won't let them.
Fuck Israel
Palestinians are trying to defend themselves too ya know.lowing wrote:
If Islam were to lay down their weapons right now, there would be peace. If Israel were to lay down their weapons right now there would be no Israel.AussieReaper wrote:
And you don't see a problem with that?
You don't know why they are lobbing rockets over the border do you? You just think it's cause they are evil Muslims. Is that it?
No, I don't see a problem with defending yourself from attacks by beating those that do it.
Islamic nations have started at least 4 major conflicts ( probably more) in the past 70 years against Israel.
Sorry Dilbert, they declared war on Israel the day after their independence.Dilbert_X wrote:
Israel started the first conflict IIRC, they haven't been beaten back yet.lowing wrote:
If Islam were to lay down their weapons right now, there would be peace. If Israel were to lay down their weapons right now there would be no Israel.AussieReaper wrote:
And you don't see a problem with that?
You don't know why they are lobbing rockets over the border do you? You just think it's cause they are evil Muslims. Is that it?
No, I don't see a problem with defending yourself from attacks by beating those that do it.
Islamic nations have started at least 4 major conflicts ( probably more) in the past 70 years against Israel.
If the allies had laid down their arms in 1940 there would have been peace.
Is that your plan for world peace? Surrender to aggressors?Was looking for recent quotes from Islamic countries other than Palestine, for you to back up your claim that no Islamic country will ever make peace with Israel.I said they are not interested in peace with Israel, the Islamic goal is and has always been the destruction of Israel and the reclaiming of the holy lands for Muslims. and I just gave you countless quotes from those engaged in that war right now, claiming that position.
Are we not talking about the VERY PEOPLE engaged in war with Israel right now? I have proven they do not want peace with Israel, they want it destroyed, and any treaty's would be considered a temp fix until the REAL FIX of the destruction of Israel could be achieved.
Never ever said one word about ALL MUSIMS get that out of your head. However the religion of Islam and those in leadership rolls within Islam and Palestine have made it clear their intended goal for Israel shall I quote them again?dayarath wrote:
lowing, read lone survivor?
The mindset of the guy must've been quite the same to your own, they're not all bad.
No my point is there will never be a negotiated peace with Israel. History and stated Islamic intentions, have shown that. If one Islamic nation, say Iran, were to go to war with Israel, their stated intention to destroy Israel, all other Islamic nations would fight with Iran or sit back to see what Iran does. If Iran takes a beating, they will then join Iran. No Islamic nation will fight on the side of Israel, regardless.Dilbert_X wrote:
Its lowing's point, that Israel can never make a deal because the neighbouring countries won't let them.
2 responses:AussieReaper wrote:
Palestinians are trying to defend themselves too ya know.lowing wrote:
If Islam were to lay down their weapons right now, there would be peace. If Israel were to lay down their weapons right now there would be no Israel.AussieReaper wrote:
And you don't see a problem with that?
You don't know why they are lobbing rockets over the border do you? You just think it's cause they are evil Muslims. Is that it?
No, I don't see a problem with defending yourself from attacks by beating those that do it.
Islamic nations have started at least 4 major conflicts ( probably more) in the past 70 years against Israel.
First. THen stop the rhetoric of destroying Israel, stop launching rockets in response to Israel pull outs, stop sucker punching Israel from known populated civilian locations then bitch when it gets hit and civilians are killed. Plenty Palestinians can do to show they are willing to REALLY seek peace. But kinda hard to believe when they are quoted what I showed you.
2nd. It is war, tough shit if they are loosing it. Surrender then
Last edited by lowing (2011-02-25 11:26:22)
Don't worry.. wasn't arguing with you, I'm just saying it's not all black and white. At the end of the day, religion is just a tool used to get stuff done. Always been that way. Interpretations of religious texts vary wildly as cultures evolve.lowing wrote:
Never ever said one word about ALL MUSIMS get that out of your head. However the religion of Islam and those in leadership rolls within Islam and Palestine have made it clear their intended goal for Israel shall I quote them again?
Destruction of either Israel or ME doesn't seem that rosy to me though, there's a lot that needs to change in the arab world, definitely, but I won't go as far as to say that it's impossible for them to live side by side.
inane little opines
Not worried if you were arguing, just making sure we are clear as to what I am saying. Didn't I hear once that you couldn't travel in some Islamic countries if you had an Israeli visa on your passport? Even some stupid shit like that shows Islam with a fucked up attitude. YOu don't even have to be Jewish, just going to Israel is enough to keep you locked out of an Islamic country. Hatred that great can not be ignored or denied, they will never submit to peace with an existing Israel.dayarath wrote:
Don't worry.. wasn't arguing with you, I'm just saying it's not all black and white. At the end of the day, religion is just a tool used to get stuff done. Always been that way. Interpretations of religious texts vary wildly as cultures evolve.lowing wrote:
Never ever said one word about ALL MUSIMS get that out of your head. However the religion of Islam and those in leadership rolls within Islam and Palestine have made it clear their intended goal for Israel shall I quote them again?
Destruction of either Israel or ME doesn't seem that rosy to me though, there's a lot that needs to change in the arab world, definitely, but I won't go as far as to say that it's impossible for them to live side by side.
What we can hope for is that these revolutions throughout the ME will have some positive effect on the whole situation, as it stands now neither side seems to be truly willing to work for peace.
At some point, they'll have to either get tired of fighting or blow eachother up.
At some point, they'll have to either get tired of fighting or blow eachother up.
inane little opines
I have little hope for the ME in any way shape or form that they will get tired of fighting. They will just have to blow each other updayarath wrote:
What we can hope for is that these revolutions throughout the ME will have some positive effect on the whole situation, as it stands now neither side seems to be truly willing to work for peace.
At some point, they'll have to either get tired of fighting or blow eachother up.
No, you've got that the wrong way round.lowing wrote:
Not worried if you were arguing, just making sure we are clear as to what I am saying. Didn't I hear once that you couldn't travel in some Islamic countries if you had an Israeli visa on your passport? Even some stupid shit like that shows Islam with a fucked up attitude. YOu don't even have to be Jewish, just going to Israel is enough to keep you locked out of an Islamic country. Hatred that great can not be ignored or denied, they will never submit to peace with an existing Israel.
It's much harder to go to Israel with passport stamps from Islamic countries than it is to go to Islamic countries with passport stamps from Israel on your passport (as seen in a recent episode of Top Gear - just to give you a widely known example).
If you ask me, shit like that shows the Israelis have a fucked up attitude.
But of course you will have no problem with that, because you'll just apply your typical double standards to it (terrible if any Islamic countries do it, fine if Israel does).
Last edited by Bertster7 (2011-02-25 11:59:41)
Is there a history of Israelis committing terrorist acts in Arab countries? Is there a history of Arabs committing terrorist acts in Israel?Bertster7 wrote:
No, you've got that the wrong way round.lowing wrote:
Not worried if you were arguing, just making sure we are clear as to what I am saying. Didn't I hear once that you couldn't travel in some Islamic countries if you had an Israeli visa on your passport? Even some stupid shit like that shows Islam with a fucked up attitude. YOu don't even have to be Jewish, just going to Israel is enough to keep you locked out of an Islamic country. Hatred that great can not be ignored or denied, they will never submit to peace with an existing Israel.
It's much harder to go to Israel with passport stamps from Islamic countries than it is to go to Islamic countries with passport stamps from Israel on your passport (as seen in a recent episode of Top Gear - just to give you a widely known example).
If you ask me, shit like that shows the Israelis have a fucked up attitude.
But of course you will have no problem with that, because you'll just apply your typical double standards to it (terrible if any Islamic countries do it, fine if Israel does).
Should the US scrutinize Arabs more when people enter our country or should they scrutinize people from all countries equally?
Not all Arabs are bad or evil Berster, but there has been a minority that has made life difficult for everyone else. Don't blame the countries that choose to protect themselves, blame that minority. In essence, what you are doing is blaming the victim.
And what Arab countries do with their own security doesn't matter to me. Why does it bother you? If Israelis started hijacking aircraft or going on shooting rampages at the Olympics don't you think Israeli passports would be scrutinized?
Last edited by JohnG@lt (2011-02-25 12:04:41)
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
Who do you think has killed more people in acts of terrorism, Palestinian terrorist organisations or Israeli ones?JohnG@lt wrote:
Is there a history of Israelis committing terrorist acts in Arab countries? Is there a history of Arabs committing terrorist acts in Israel?Bertster7 wrote:
No, you've got that the wrong way round.lowing wrote:
Not worried if you were arguing, just making sure we are clear as to what I am saying. Didn't I hear once that you couldn't travel in some Islamic countries if you had an Israeli visa on your passport? Even some stupid shit like that shows Islam with a fucked up attitude. YOu don't even have to be Jewish, just going to Israel is enough to keep you locked out of an Islamic country. Hatred that great can not be ignored or denied, they will never submit to peace with an existing Israel.
It's much harder to go to Israel with passport stamps from Islamic countries than it is to go to Islamic countries with passport stamps from Israel on your passport (as seen in a recent episode of Top Gear - just to give you a widely known example).
If you ask me, shit like that shows the Israelis have a fucked up attitude.
But of course you will have no problem with that, because you'll just apply your typical double standards to it (terrible if any Islamic countries do it, fine if Israel does).
Should the US scrutinize Arabs more when people enter our country or should they scrutinize people from all countries equally?
Not all Arabs are bad or evil Berster, but there has been a minority that has made life difficult for everyone else. Don't blame the countries that choose to protect themselves, blame that minority. In essence, what you are doing is blaming the victim.
And what Arab countries do with their own security doesn't matter to me. Why does it bother you? If Israelis started hijacking aircraft or going on shooting rampages at the Olympics don't you think Israeli passports would be scrutinized?
Put it in some context and stop being so obtuse.
In any case, that post was more about taking the piss out of the fact that lowing has claimed that the whole passport thing shows Islam as having a fucked up attitude - when in fact he's got his facts the wrong way round, but of course despite the fact he considers that to show Arabs in a bad light, I bet he doesn't when it comes to Israel - which shows clear double standards.
Last edited by Bertster7 (2011-02-25 12:12:16)
damn I am right again.Bertster7 wrote:
No, you've got that the wrong way round.lowing wrote:
Not worried if you were arguing, just making sure we are clear as to what I am saying. Didn't I hear once that you couldn't travel in some Islamic countries if you had an Israeli visa on your passport? Even some stupid shit like that shows Islam with a fucked up attitude. YOu don't even have to be Jewish, just going to Israel is enough to keep you locked out of an Islamic country. Hatred that great can not be ignored or denied, they will never submit to peace with an existing Israel.
It's much harder to go to Israel with passport stamps from Islamic countries than it is to go to Islamic countries with passport stamps from Israel on your passport (as seen in a recent episode of Top Gear - just to give you a widely known example).
If you ask me, shit like that shows the Israelis have a fucked up attitude.
But of course you will have no problem with that, because you'll just apply your typical double standards to it (terrible if any Islamic countries do it, fine if Israel does).
http://cominganarchy.com/2010/06/15/whe … -stamp-a-d
plenty on the net regarding this. Cant seem to find anything where Israel rejects visa's from Islamic countries. Maybe you can help me?
That isn't at all what you were saying. You said people from Muslim countries have their passports scrutinized more entering Israel than Israelis do entering Muslim countries. So please answer the question. Who is more likely to commit international acts of terrorism? Israelis or Muslims? Based on this who should have their passports checked more thoroughly when traveling internationally?Bertster7 wrote:
Who do you think has killed more people in acts of terrorism, Palestinian terrorist organisations or Israeli ones?
Put it in some context and stop being so obtuse.
And it's got nothing to do with double standards and everything to do with probability and limited security resources.
Last edited by JohnG@lt (2011-02-25 12:14:31)
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
ummmm Islamic radicals?Bertster7 wrote:
Who do you think has killed more people in acts of terrorism, Palestinian terrorist organisations or Israeli ones?JohnG@lt wrote:
Is there a history of Israelis committing terrorist acts in Arab countries? Is there a history of Arabs committing terrorist acts in Israel?Bertster7 wrote:
No, you've got that the wrong way round.
It's much harder to go to Israel with passport stamps from Islamic countries than it is to go to Islamic countries with passport stamps from Israel on your passport (as seen in a recent episode of Top Gear - just to give you a widely known example).
If you ask me, shit like that shows the Israelis have a fucked up attitude.
But of course you will have no problem with that, because you'll just apply your typical double standards to it (terrible if any Islamic countries do it, fine if Israel does).
Should the US scrutinize Arabs more when people enter our country or should they scrutinize people from all countries equally?
Not all Arabs are bad or evil Berster, but there has been a minority that has made life difficult for everyone else. Don't blame the countries that choose to protect themselves, blame that minority. In essence, what you are doing is blaming the victim.
And what Arab countries do with their own security doesn't matter to me. Why does it bother you? If Israelis started hijacking aircraft or going on shooting rampages at the Olympics don't you think Israeli passports would be scrutinized?
Put it in some context and stop being so obtuse.
In any case, that post was more about taking the piss out of the fact that lowing has claimed that the whole passport thing shows Islam as having a fucked up attitude - when in fact he's got his facts the wrong way round, but of course despite the fact he considers that to show Arabs in a bad light, I bet he doesn't when it comes to Israel - which shows clear double standards.
Radicals. You mean not all Muslims are terrorists? You mean there are subsets and you classify them in such a way? Why would you do such a thing? Have you been given cause?lowing wrote:
ummmm Islamic radicals?Bertster7 wrote:
Who do you think has killed more people in acts of terrorism, Palestinian terrorist organisations or Israeli ones?JohnG@lt wrote:
Is there a history of Israelis committing terrorist acts in Arab countries? Is there a history of Arabs committing terrorist acts in Israel?
Should the US scrutinize Arabs more when people enter our country or should they scrutinize people from all countries equally?
Not all Arabs are bad or evil Berster, but there has been a minority that has made life difficult for everyone else. Don't blame the countries that choose to protect themselves, blame that minority. In essence, what you are doing is blaming the victim.
And what Arab countries do with their own security doesn't matter to me. Why does it bother you? If Israelis started hijacking aircraft or going on shooting rampages at the Olympics don't you think Israeli passports would be scrutinized?
Put it in some context and stop being so obtuse.
In any case, that post was more about taking the piss out of the fact that lowing has claimed that the whole passport thing shows Islam as having a fucked up attitude - when in fact he's got his facts the wrong way round, but of course despite the fact he considers that to show Arabs in a bad light, I bet he doesn't when it comes to Israel - which shows clear double standards.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
nope, just staying consistent with everything I have posted in the past. Never included "all Muslims" in anything I have said, and never reasoned that Islam the religion, is the same as a Muslim the individual. Hard to get anyone to acknowledge that though. They seem to think that a person and a religion are the same thing.JohnG@lt wrote:
Radicals. You mean not all Muslims are terrorists? You mean there are subsets and you classify them in such a way? Why would you do such a thing? Have you been given cause?lowing wrote:
ummmm Islamic radicals?Bertster7 wrote:
Who do you think has killed more people in acts of terrorism, Palestinian terrorist organisations or Israeli ones?
Put it in some context and stop being so obtuse.
In any case, that post was more about taking the piss out of the fact that lowing has claimed that the whole passport thing shows Islam as having a fucked up attitude - when in fact he's got his facts the wrong way round, but of course despite the fact he considers that to show Arabs in a bad light, I bet he doesn't when it comes to Israel - which shows clear double standards.
So if you separate radicals from 'all muslims' you are just being logical aren't you? If you see a black man walking down the street wearing gang colors and covered in tattoos does it make you a racist to cross the street? Of course not. You would do the same if you saw a white guy walking down the street with white supremacist tattoos.lowing wrote:
nope, just staying consistent with everything I have posted in the past. Never included "all Muslims" in anything I have said, and never reasoned that Islam the religion, is the same as a Muslim the individual. Hard to get anyone to acknowledge that though. They seem to think that a person and a religion are the same thing.JohnG@lt wrote:
Radicals. You mean not all Muslims are terrorists? You mean there are subsets and you classify them in such a way? Why would you do such a thing? Have you been given cause?lowing wrote:
ummmm Islamic radicals?
Gee lowing, you seem like the logical one in this thread.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
Well, at this point, there's two options:
1) Stay out of it
2) Side with the winner
I'm okay with #2 as long as it doesn't impact me. TBH, the place is screwed...so I've given up. It ain't ever going to be right.
So let's say the US didn't side with Israel. Arabs invade. Guess what's gonna happen next? Massive multinational invasion.
So this is being going on longer then we have all been alive. Yeah, let's talk about peace....wake up folks.
1) Stay out of it
2) Side with the winner
I'm okay with #2 as long as it doesn't impact me. TBH, the place is screwed...so I've given up. It ain't ever going to be right.
So let's say the US didn't side with Israel. Arabs invade. Guess what's gonna happen next? Massive multinational invasion.
So this is being going on longer then we have all been alive. Yeah, let's talk about peace....wake up folks.
Well, when just about everyone of my arguments is countered, not with a counter point, but charges of racism, and islamaphobia, when links that are presented to support my argument are countered with accusations of bias and dismissals and not facts or proof of false information. What can I say?JohnG@lt wrote:
So if you separate radicals from 'all muslims' you are just being logical aren't you? If you see a black man walking down the street wearing gang colors and covered in tattoos does it make you a racist to cross the street? Of course not. You would do the same if you saw a white guy walking down the street with white supremacist tattoos.lowing wrote:
nope, just staying consistent with everything I have posted in the past. Never included "all Muslims" in anything I have said, and never reasoned that Islam the religion, is the same as a Muslim the individual. Hard to get anyone to acknowledge that though. They seem to think that a person and a religion are the same thing.JohnG@lt wrote:
Radicals. You mean not all Muslims are terrorists? You mean there are subsets and you classify them in such a way? Why would you do such a thing? Have you been given cause?
Gee lowing, you seem like the logical one in this thread.
Bertster were you going to help me find stuff about Israel rejecting visa's? All I can fins is where Islamic nations reject Israeli visa's? I mean since you called it fact and all.
lowing wrote:
Sorry Dilbert, they declared war on Israel the day after their independence.Dilbert_X wrote:
Israel started the first conflict IIRC, they haven't been beaten back yet.lowing wrote:
If Islam were to lay down their weapons right now, there would be peace. If Israel were to lay down their weapons right now there would be no Israel.
No, I don't see a problem with defending yourself from attacks by beating those that do it.
Islamic nations have started at least 4 major conflicts ( probably more) in the past 70 years against Israel.
If the allies had laid down their arms in 1940 there would have been peace.
Is that your plan for world peace? Surrender to aggressors?Was looking for recent quotes from Islamic countries other than Palestine, for you to back up your claim that no Islamic country will ever make peace with Israel.I said they are not interested in peace with Israel, the Islamic goal is and has always been the destruction of Israel and the reclaiming of the holy lands for Muslims. and I just gave you countless quotes from those engaged in that war right now, claiming that position.
And the allies declared war on Germany after they invaded Poland and declared it theirs.
Are we not talking about the VERY PEOPLE engaged in war with Israel right now? I have proven they do not want peace with Israel, they want it destroyed, and any treaty's would be considered a temp fix until the REAL FIX of the destruction of Israel could be achieved.
Fuck Israel
I'm sorry, I can't seem to find any reference to a blitzkrieg waged by israel before the Islamic nations massed in force. I really wish you would dispense of this bullshit parallel you are trying to make between the Israeli Palestinian conflict and Nazi Germany. Especially since there isn't one.Dilbert_X wrote:
lowing wrote:
Sorry Dilbert, they declared war on Israel the day after their independence.Dilbert_X wrote:
Israel started the first conflict IIRC, they haven't been beaten back yet.lowing wrote:
If Islam were to lay down their weapons right now, there would be peace. If Israel were to lay down their weapons right now there would be no Israel.
No, I don't see a problem with defending yourself from attacks by beating those that do it.
Islamic nations have started at least 4 major conflicts ( probably more) in the past 70 years against Israel.
If the allies had laid down their arms in 1940 there would have been peace.
Is that your plan for world peace? Surrender to aggressors?
Was looking for recent quotes from Islamic countries other than Palestine, for you to back up your claim that no Islamic country will ever make peace with Israel.
And the allies declared war on Germany after they invaded Poland and declared it theirs.
Are we not talking about the VERY PEOPLE engaged in war with Israel right now? I have proven they do not want peace with Israel, they want it destroyed, and any treaty's would be considered a temp fix until the REAL FIX of the destruction of Israel could be achieved.
It's not war when the enemy has no army. Has no air force. Has no navy.lowing wrote:
2 responses:AussieReaper wrote:
Palestinians are trying to defend themselves too ya know.lowing wrote:
If Islam were to lay down their weapons right now, there would be peace. If Israel were to lay down their weapons right now there would be no Israel.
No, I don't see a problem with defending yourself from attacks by beating those that do it.
Islamic nations have started at least 4 major conflicts ( probably more) in the past 70 years against Israel.
First. THen stop the rhetoric of destroying Israel, stop launching rockets in response to Israel pull outs, stop sucker punching Israel from known populated civilian locations then bitch when it gets hit and civilians are killed. Plenty Palestinians can do to show they are willing to REALLY seek peace. But kinda hard to believe when they are quoted what I showed you.
2nd. It is war, tough shit if they are loosing it. Surrender then
It's murder.