BF2S Forums Police: Illegal Immigrants Raped 14yo Texas Girl at July 4th Party

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Immigrants usually don't lower the standard of living, but actually increase it because they make products a lot cheaper. Think of it like Wal-Marts coming into town.

And what do the people do that lose their jobs?  They live off of the system.  The only way to counter that is to get rid of social programs that allow that.

They either accept lower wages, or find other jobs. You're using the same arguments as the anti-immigrant leagues trying to kick out the Irish during the 19th century.

Right, so the market should be perfectly capable of clearing everything.  If someone doesn't want to work, they should starve (or may choose to steal).

Turquoise wrote:

JohnG@lt wrote:

Thousands of engineers arrive from India every year due to the shortage of graduating engineers here in America. I'm not in an unaffected field at all. I'm just confident in my own abilities and know that I will succeed in life.

Those shortages would easily become surpluses in the long run.  That's great to have that level of confidence, but it's partially the result of NOT having a completely open door to all immigrants.

Cybargs just stated my response.

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Immigrants usually don't lower the standard of living, but actually increase it because they make products a lot cheaper. Think of it like Wal-Marts coming into town.

And what do the people do that lose their jobs?  They live off of the system.  The only way to counter that is to get rid of social programs that allow that.

They either accept lower wages, or find other jobs. You're using the same arguments as the anti-immigrant leagues trying to kick out the Irish during the 19th century.

I wish I could karma more than once...

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Right, so the market should be perfectly capable of clearing everything.  If someone doesn't want to work, they should starve (or may choose to steal).

If someone doesn't want to work that's their choice in life. Not my fault someone doesn't want to remain competitive.

Fair enough.  You're only worth as much as what the lowest bidder charges.

No, you're worth as much as you make yourself worth.

Let's use me as an example against a newly minted graduate.

Me: 29 year old graduate with a 3.95 GPA, military experience in which I was a team leader, graduated from one of the top high schools in the country, many years of work experience in unrelated fields + internship within field. Minor in international business.

Them: 22 year old graduate with a 2.5 GPA (average), zero life experience.

Last edited by JohnG@lt (2010-07-15 06:39:14)

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Fair enough.  You're only worth as much as what the lowest bidder charges.

You pay peanuts, you get monkeys.

We're all monkeys -- easily replaceable monkeys.

You might be. What is it that you do for work with your economics degree?

jord wrote:

Infact yeah, Scottish is pretty orrible for a chick

There are many scottish accents, some of which are nice - You're thinking of Rab C Nesbitt.

Turquoise wrote:

JohnG@lt wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Fair enough.  You're only worth as much as what the lowest bidder charges.

No, you're worth as much as you make yourself worth.

Let's use me as an example against a newly minted graduate.

Me: 29 year old graduate with a 3.95 GPA, military experience in which I was a team leader, graduated from one of the top high schools in the country, many years of work experience in unrelated fields + internship within field. Minor in international business.

Them: 22 year old graduate with a 2.5 GPA (average), zero life experience.

But you have to get experience somewhere.  I guess if we made military service mandatory, that might work.

There was nothing stopping that 22 year old from making decisions in life that would make him more desirable as a worker and a better future leader to boot. That 22 year old is nothing more than a slightly overeducated high school graduate with debt.

Turquoise wrote:

JohnG@lt wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Fair enough.  You're only worth as much as what the lowest bidder charges.

No, you're worth as much as you make yourself worth.

Let's use me as an example against a newly minted graduate.

Me: 29 year old graduate with a 3.95 GPA, military experience in which I was a team leader, graduated from one of the top high schools in the country, many years of work experience in unrelated fields + internship within field. Minor in international business.

Them: 22 year old graduate with a 2.5 GPA (average), zero life experience.

But you have to get experience somewhere.  I guess if we made military service mandatory, that might work.

Become an unpaid intern during college.

JohnG@lt wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

JohnG@lt wrote:

No, you're worth as much as you make yourself worth.

Let's use me as an example against a newly minted graduate.

Me: 29 year old graduate with a 3.95 GPA, military experience in which I was a team leader, graduated from one of the top high schools in the country, many years of work experience in unrelated fields + internship within field. Minor in international business.

Them: 22 year old graduate with a 2.5 GPA (average), zero life experience.

But you have to get experience somewhere.  I guess if we made military service mandatory, that might work.

There was nothing stopping that 22 year old from making decisions in life that would make him more desirable as a worker and a better future leader to boot. That 22 year old is nothing more than a slightly overeducated high school graduate with debt.

Fair enough.  I guess I should pick up my copy of Atlas Shrugged and read it again.  Apparently, self-determination is all you need to succeed.

Turquoise wrote:

JohnG@lt wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

But you have to get experience somewhere.  I guess if we made military service mandatory, that might work.

There was nothing stopping that 22 year old from making decisions in life that would make him more desirable as a worker and a better future leader to boot. That 22 year old is nothing more than a slightly overeducated high school graduate with debt.

Fair enough.  I guess I should pick up my copy of Atlas Shrugged and read it again.  Apparently, self-determination is all you need to succeed.

America is the economic super house today due to all that shit about the power of the individual and rugged individualism.

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Fair enough.  I guess I should pick up my copy of Atlas Shrugged and read it again.  Apparently, self-determination is all you need to succeed.

America is the economic super house today due to all that shit about the power of the individual and rugged individualism.

Well, that and economic imperialism.

Other colonial powers tried that and had more colonies. Still didn't make them as powerful as the US is today. The American ethos of individualism really did help it out during the west ward expansion, and for taking risks and shit.

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Well, that and economic imperialism.

Other colonial powers tried that and had more colonies. Still didn't make them as powerful as the US is today. The American ethos of individualism really did help it out during the west ward expansion, and for taking risks and shit.

Ok, I'll give you that to a degree.  Still, I would argue it had more to do with having a shitload of resources, geographical advantages (like not being next to aggressive and powerful countries), and economically expanding at the right period of time technologically speaking.

Can't do all that without self-determination Same as why the Puritan colonies were a lot better off than the ones in the South because of work ethic and individualism.