BF2S Forums Obama's October Surprise - 2010

Dilbert_X wrote:

So when did you have troops fighting in Vietnam from exactly?

The Vietnam War [A 2] was a Cold War  military conflict that occurred in Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia  from November 1, 1955 [A 1], to April 30, 1975 when Saigon fell.

The United States entered the war to prevent a communist takeover of South Vietnam as part of their wider strategy of containment. Military advisors arrived beginning in 1950. U.S. involvement escalated in the early 1960s, with U.S. troop levels tripling in 1961 and tripling again in 1962.[19]  U.S. combat units were deployed beginning in 1965. Operations spanned borders, with Laos and Cambodia heavily bombed. Involvement peaked in 1968 at the time of the Tet Offensive. After this, U.S. ground forces were withdrawn as part of a policy called Vietnamization. Despite the Paris Peace Accords, signed by all parties in January 1973, fighting continued.

The Case-Church Amendment passed by the U.S. Congress prohibited use of American military after August 15, 1973 unless the president secured congressional approval in advance.[20] The capture of Saigon by the North Vietnamese army in April 1975 marked the end of the Vietnam War.

Roger Morris, a former Foreign Service Officer and National Security Council staff member under presidents Lyndon Johnson and Richard Nixon, writing in the Asia Times, argues that as early as 1973-74 the CIA began offering covert backing to Islamic radical rebels in Afghanistan

1985: However, one of the main features of NSDD-166 was to allow CIA to enter Afghanistan directly and establish its own separate and secret relationships with Afghan fighters.[7] The funding by ISI and CIA of Afghan anti-Soviet fighters created linkages among Muslim fighters worldwide

Question: The former director of the CIA, Robert Gates, stated in his memoirs ["From the Shadows"], that American intelligence services began to aid the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan 6 months before the Soviet intervention. In this period you were the national security adviser to President Carter. You therefore played a role in this affair. Is that correct?

Brzezinski: Yes. According to the official version of history, CIA aid to the Mujahadeen began during 1980, that is to say, after the Soviet army invaded Afghanistan, 24 Dec 1979. But the reality, secretly guarded until now, is completely otherwise Indeed, it was July 3, 1979 that President Carter signed the first directive for secret aid to the opponents of the pro-Soviet regime in Kabul. And that very day, I wrote a note to the president in which I explained to him that in my opinion this aid was going to induce a Soviet military intervention.

Q: Despite this risk, you were an advocate of this covert action. But perhaps you yourself desired this Soviet entry into war and looked to provoke it?

B: It isn't quite that. We didn't push the Russians to intervene, but we knowingly increased the probability that they would.

Q: When the Soviets justified their intervention by asserting that they intended to fight against a secret involvement of the United States in Afghanistan, people didn't believe them. However, there was a basis of truth. You don't regret anything today?

B: Regret what? That secret operation was an excellent idea. It had the effect of drawing the Russians into the Afghan trap and you want me to regret it? The day that the Soviets officially crossed the border, I wrote to President Carter. We now have the opportunity of giving to the USSR its Vietnam war. Indeed, for almost 10 years, Moscow had to carry on a war unsupportable by the government, a conflict that brought about the demoralization and finally the breakup of the Soviet empire.

Q: And neither do you regret having supported the Islamic fundamentalism, having given arms and advice to future terrorists?

B: What is most important to the history of the world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?

Q: Some stirred-up Moslems? But it has been said and repeated Islamic fundamentalism represents a world menace today.

B: Nonsense! It is said that the West had a global policy in regard to Islam. That is stupid. There isn't a global Islam. Look at Islam in a rational manner and without demagoguery or emotion. It is the leading religion of the world with 1.5 billion followers. But what is there in common among Saudi Arabian fundamentalism, moderate Morocco, Pakistan militarism, Egyptian pro-Western or Central Asian secularism? Nothing more than what unites the Christian countries.

11 Bravo wrote:

nice site lol

ya know for as stupid as you guys say the US govt is you sure give them tons of credit for some difficult things.

Harmor wrote:

I wonder what's going to come put 30 years from now about what we're doing in Pakistan right now.../boggle.

Cybargs wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Harmor wrote:

I wonder what's going to come put 30 years from now about what we're doing in Pakistan right now.../boggle.

When Obama's before the Hague over all the drone strikes we'll see.

That shit was sanctioned by the Pakistani gov. US doesn't have to follow the geneva convention if hajji doesn't.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2010-07-11 23:44:51)

Dilbert_X wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

When Obama's before the Hague over all the drone strikes we'll see.

That shit was sanctioned by the Pakistani gov. US doesn't have to follow the geneva convention if hajji doesn't.

The Pakistani govt can't sign off on extra-judicial execution of its civilian citizens by a foreign military now can it?

FEOS wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

The Pakistani govt can't sign off on extra-judicial execution of its civilian citizens by a foreign military now can it?

They stopped using drones now afaik. No point of using them, just pisses off the local populace.

No we haven't. Just doesn't get much press.