BF2S Forums "Dear American Liberals" a letter from a law student.

DrunkFace wrote:

lowing wrote:

[F7F7]KiNG_KaDaFFHi wrote:

Why should EVERYTHING we do generate income? Why?

Somethings should be run by the goverment and not greedy leaches, like the postalsystem, healthcare, infrastructure in general actually.

I understand the idea of a company very well, that´s why I rather have a powerful goverment then powerful companies.

We generate income to cover the costs and give us the opportunity,to enjoy doing all fun shit, that DOES NOT generate income. How hard is that to grasp. Try going on vacation with no money. Try pursuing your favorite hobby with no money. You really need to get real here.

Go back to Germany, you were a much nicer person there.

Why are you always, me me me. Why can't you be more about we. Help your community, and your community will help you. By helping those less fortunate you create a safer environment a nicer environment.  But you also create a larger potential market for your company to grow and increase profits or get a promotion.

I already "help my community", I pay my taxes. 30% of my income in fact, and that does not include what I give in consumption taxes. So do you mind, I mean if it isn't too much trouble, if I spend the rest of what I have worked for and EARNED, on MY quality of life and the quality of life for my family? I would greatly appreciate it.

I have a hard time grasping your willingness and justification to actually complain about me, a person who does contribute, and have nothing to say in my defense, against those that take from me and give nothing back, ya know, "to help the community" that I live in.

Here is another news flash. My responsibilities end at my family and my friends after I pay my taxes, I am not the community babysitter. I am doer, I suggest others start DOing as well.
Again, I observe you have no chest beating in you, telling others what they should be doing in the first place, only in what I should be doing MORE of..............and you have me as the greedy, selfish, self centered one. got it

Last edited by lowing (2009-03-14 07:34:30)

DrunkFace wrote:

You earn more then $450,000 pa? Well done.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/e … 08.svg.png

Sorry about that I mis typed, I am in the 28% tax bracket, so yeah ya got me on that one, anyway, wwhy don't you address the meat of my post and its content rather than nit pick percentages. Since, this post could very well come from a person who makes 450,000 a year. What would your response be to that person?


Here it is again: explain away,

I already "help my community", I pay my taxes. 30% of my income in fact, and that does not include what I give in consumption taxes. So do you mind, I mean if it isn't too much trouble, if I spend the rest of what I have worked for and EARNED, on MY quality of life and the quality of life for my family? I would greatly appreciate it.

I have a hard time grasping your willingness and justification to actually complain about me, a person who does contribute, and have nothing to say in my defense, against those that take from me and give nothing back, ya know, "to help the community" that I live in.

Here is another news flash. My responsibilities end at my family and my friends after I pay my taxes, I am not the community babysitter. I am doer, I suggest others start DOing as well.
Again, I observe you have no chest beating in you, telling others what they should be doing in the first place, only in what I should be doing MORE of..............and you have me as the greedy, selfish, self centered one. got it

jungle charm.

lowing wrote:

I already "help my community", I pay my taxes. 30% of my income in fact, and that does not include what I give in consumption taxes. So do you mind, I mean if it isn't too much trouble, if I spend the rest of what I have worked for and EARNED, on MY quality of life and the quality of life for my family? I would greatly appreciate it.

I don't consider your helping your community to be enough. And that 30% goes towards the public services which you use each and every day.

AussieReaper wrote:

lowing wrote:

I already "help my community", I pay my taxes. 30% of my income in fact, and that does not include what I give in consumption taxes. So do you mind, I mean if it isn't too much trouble, if I spend the rest of what I have worked for and EARNED, on MY quality of life and the quality of life for my family? I would greatly appreciate it.

I don't consider your helping your community to be enough. And that 30% goes towards the public services which you use each and every day.

I rarely say stuff like this Aussie, but that it probably the most idiotic response I have read.

Especially since you did not tell me why you think I do not do enough, while giving passes to those that do not do shit.

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

lowing wrote:

I already "help my community", I pay my taxes. 30% of my income in fact, and that does not include what I give in consumption taxes. So do you mind, I mean if it isn't too much trouble, if I spend the rest of what I have worked for and EARNED, on MY quality of life and the quality of life for my family? I would greatly appreciate it.

I don't consider your helping your community to be enough. And that 30% goes towards the public services which you use each and every day.

I rarely say stuff like this Aussie, but that it probably the most idiotic response I have read.

Especially since you did not tell me why you think I do not do enough, while giving passes to those that do not do shit.

I didn't give a pass to those who do not do shit. But you helping out at the local soup kitchen does not mean that you should get a tax break because your deed for the week has been done.

AussieReaper wrote:

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

I don't consider your helping your community to be enough. And that 30% goes towards the public services which you use each and every day.

I rarely say stuff like this Aussie, but that it probably the most idiotic response I have read.

Especially since you did not tell me why you think I do not do enough, while giving passes to those that do not do shit.

I didn't give a pass to those who do not do shit. But you helping out at the local soup kitchen does not mean that you should get a tax break because your deed for the week has been done.

So if I helped out at the local soup kitichens ans spoon feed poor not only metaphorically by also literally, then I would be a great guy.

No time for it, I will leave that honor to the liberal celebrities and politicians who need it for a publicity campaign, to let people see just how great they are and to let us all know that they are really "just one of us", before they hop in the private jet full of steak and lobster to the next city to ladle out soup again, or to some third world country to hold a hungry kid for the cameras.

Last edited by lowing (2009-03-15 08:41:36)

lets see..... any military officialy generating any income?

lowing wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

lowing wrote:

I rarely say stuff like this Aussie, but that it probably the most idiotic response I have read.

Especially since you did not tell me why you think I do not do enough, while giving passes to those that do not do shit.

I didn't give a pass to those who do not do shit. But you helping out at the local soup kitchen does not mean that you should get a tax break because your deed for the week has been done.

So if I helped out at the local soup kitichens ans spoon feed poor not only metaphorically by also literally, then I would be a great guy.

No time for it, I will leave that honor to the liberal celebrities and politicians who need it for a publicity campaign, to let people see just how great they are and to let us all know that they are really "just one of us", before they hop in the private jet full of steak and lobster to the next city to ladle out soup again, or to some third world country to hold a hungry kid for the cameras.

Have you ever met charity workers? I've never met any 'liberal celebrities and politicians', only people generally concerned about those less fortunate and willing to help out.

Last edited by Spark (2009-03-15 22:28:28)

you're a smart young guy Poseidon... and passionate which is admirable... but BO is not going to be remembered as a good president...
You live in LI so your parents make good money(assumption cause i lived there and its way expensive...lol...)
How do your parents feel about Obama(in addition to your opinion)
...his... take care of you cradle to the grave idea...
and the tax everyone and we will tell you what's good for you mentality?
  People voted for Obama because of his slick oratory skills... he has no track record... the media was in the tank for him... if anyone questioned him... they were a racist...  I will let the next year or so unfold and we can all see what happens...

his support is slipping... Moderate democrats also...
http://www.slate.com/id/2213351/pagenum/all/
http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/oba … 03-11.html
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar … /OPINION01
http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/200 … at_ba.html

and i respect the office of the president... but not his policies...

Poseidon wrote:

lowing wrote:

Poseidon wrote:

So basically, you have no answer. You can't answer because you don't know why. It goes against everything you said.

You call everyone who voted for and/or supported Obama a socialist or a liberal - you're doing it right now with me, yet the majority of the of the richest people in America, people who earned their money (something you claim liberals don't do and that liberals aren't successful) voted for Obama.

The simple fact is that you yourself can't explain it because it goes against everything and nearly every argument against liberals you've damn near had.

No wonder why you backed rammunition up so much. You dodge just as much as he does.

Why are asking me why other people do what they do? Ask them why they voted for Obama. Also while you sare asking them, ask them if they made their fortunes under liberal ideology or under the capitalist system. Please stop ignoring that point.

I posted a link that offered reasons why theses rich people voted for Obama, why is that not good enough for you?

You're still missing the point, lowing. I'm not disagreeing that they made their fortunes under the capitalist ideology. But you link everyone who voted for or supported Obama to socialism and call anyone who supported him a socialist. So wouldn't it be that these rich people who voted for Obama - people like Warren Buffett, Bill Gates, Eric Schmidt and celebrities like Oprah and Robert De Niro are the most successful people on Earth, more successful than you - whilst being, according to you...socialists? It negates everything you've said.

And the link isn't good enough because those people don't share your hard line views, and therefore it's not the same. I want to know why YOU think the richest people in America voted for Obama.

and you are missing the point, regardless as to how they VOTED, they made their fortunes doing EXACTLY what socialism (and supposedly what they believe) does not perpetuate.

In other words like a typical liberal, they want to tell the rest of us what we should be doing and how we should be spending our money, while they do something completely different. Hypocrites! Just like Gore and his eco-friendly bullshit. while he owns private jets and 10,000 sq ft houses, he tells the rest of us that we are not doing enough for the environment. I suppose you think his practices does nothing to negate his words, like the practices of the rich going against the message they send to the rest of us.



The link I posted had some pretty good reasoning behind why the rich voted the way they did, if that isn't good enough for you I am sorry.

Last edited by lowing (2009-03-16 04:32:42)

DrunkFace wrote:

lowing wrote:

Poseidon wrote:

You're still missing the point, lowing. I'm not disagreeing that they made their fortunes under the capitalist ideology. But you link everyone who voted for or supported Obama to socialism and call anyone who supported him a socialist. So wouldn't it be that these rich people who voted for Obama - people like Warren Buffett, Bill Gates, Eric Schmidt and celebrities like Oprah and Robert De Niro are the most successful people on Earth, more successful than you - whilst being, according to you...socialists? It negates everything you've said.

And the link isn't good enough because those people don't share your hard line views, and therefore it's not the same. I want to know why YOU think the richest people in America voted for Obama.

and you are missing the point, regardless as to how they VOTED, they made their fortunes doing EXACTLY what socialism (and supposedly what they believe) does not perpetuate.

In other words like a typical liberal, they want to tell the rest of us what we should be doing and how we should be spending our money, while they do something completely different. Hypocrites! Just like Gore and his eco-friendly bullshit. while he owns private jets and 10,000 sq ft houses, he tells the rest of us that we are not doing enough for the environment. I suppose you think his practices does nothing to negate his words, like the practices of the rich going against the message they send to the rest of us.



The link I posted had some pretty good reasoning behind why the rich voted the way they did, if that isn't good enough for you I am sorry.

You are missing the point. What you think is 'liberal' and 'socialist', is just not true. There are thousands of million and billionaires who made fortunes who had to pay high  taxes and 'support' everyone else in much more liberal and socialist countries.

Yup and America is one of those countries, now however, Obama is saying it is not enough to pay more than everyone else in taxes, now he is saying you have to pay even more, not to fund the functions of govt. but to share your wealth with others forcibly. This is socialism sorry.

and those billionaires did not mass their fortunes under a socialist ideology, they did so under the very capitalist ideology that you despise and think is so evil and "unfair". So which is it? Are you going to applaud their efforts and their capitalist gains? or are you going to condemn them for getting rich "unfairly"?

I do understand why you want to avoid that point, hailing these liberal billionaire voters for voting for socialism, yet not acknowledging that it was not socialism that got them rich in the first place. I am sure they probably don't wanna talk about it much either..



I like this answer as well


"You apparently don't understand the difference between "income" and "wealth"

Bill Gates, Ted Kennedy & Warren Buffet live off money they earned decades ago (except Kennedy who inherited, he has never earned a dime). You don't pay taxes on the existence of "wealth" you pay taxes on what you EARN.

Most people who are still earning the money they live on did not vote for your Communist Obama. The wealthy who did vote for him know that their wealth is secure and only their up and coming competitors will be crushed by Obama and his minions.

You can be certain that no company starting in a two car garage will become the next "Apple" and no sharp young mind will give Microsoft a legitimate challenge after the Lib-Tards stomp out everyone who works for a living and crushes all those with an entrepreneurial spirit.

The biggest lie I have heard in awhile is that Gates & Buffet did not "vote their self interest".

If you believe that I have a bridge in Brooklyn I would like to sell you real cheap."

Last edited by lowing (2009-03-16 07:51:37)

DrunkFace wrote:

lowing wrote:

Obama is saying it is not enough to pay more than everyone else in taxes, now he is saying you have to pay even more

What?

not to fund the functions of govt. but to share your wealth with others forcibly. This is socialism sorry.

Transfer payments is a function of Government and is done extensively in many countries.

and those billionaires did not mass their fortunes under a socialist ideology, they did so under the very capitalist ideology

No country is 100% socialist, but then again no country is 100% capitalist either. There are plenty of people who made fortunes in countries much more socialist with much higher taxes and much higher minimum wages (read: expenses) then the US, even now.

here's the relative tax rates of 4 countries. Notice the US is the only one to tax the poor?
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4871/tax.jpg
and their minimum wages.
US: $6.55
UK: £5.73
Australia: $14.31
Canada: $7.75

that you despise and think is so evil and "unfair".

I do think the US system is unfair, but I don't despise or think the ideals of capitalism are unfair as long as there a social programs to ensure everyone has an equal ability to succeed.

So which is it? Are you going to applaud their efforts and their capitalist gains? or are you going to condemn them for getting rich "unfairly"?

If you got rich by working hard, putting the effort in and taking risks then I have nothing but admiration, but in the US system thats just not enough, you need money as well.

I do understand why you want to avoid that point, hailing these liberal billionaire voters for voting for socialism, yet not acknowledging that it was not socialism that got them rich in the first place. I am sure they probably don't wanna talk about it much either..

Many would have used state funded schools, universities, tech colleges, apprenticeships and health care. Their parents would have received money and/or tax deductions from the government, in some cases they would have also received government housing, rent assistance, youth allowance, study grants and more. All socialist programs paid for by the taxes on the rich to ensure that anyone and everyone was provided with enough to have the ability to succeed.

What do you mean "What"? Havent ya read the papers? Yeah Obama is going punish achievment eve nmore to satisfy his "sharing the wealth" beliefs

No, our govts. job has nothing to go with taking money from one person for redistribution to another.

Maybe so, but they did not amass their fortune by socialist ideology, they did so through cutthroat capitalism and competition. Not by hand holding their competators in order to be "fair" or "neighborly". You simply can not practice what you preach and get rich.

We do have equal ability to succeed, just as much as you, or is there some other reason why all of your citizens are not millionaires. SInce they all presumably had the same chance to become one. and if not, what makes your system more fair than ours?


Bullshit, plenty of people have built empires and started with nothing.

Well at least you admit it, you force the rich to baby sit the rest of you. I for one do not believe it is up to someone else to make sure you make it in life..
Here in America, that is your responsibility, ( or it used to be) now it looks as if we are gunna join you and pawn off the responsibility of taking care of ourselves onto the rich people, and why not? They can afford it right? Besides they do not need all that money anyway, and for them to not want us to steal it from them would be be greedy!