Thats a bad thing? I joined when Clinton was President, I am willing to bet he was/will be, ten times worse then Obama.TheAussieReaper wrote:
Or the opposite. Warman said he wouldn't join the army now Obama is in office.ATG wrote:
maybe you have to be somewhat mentally clumsy to be in the military under george bush and company post 2004 ?
I don't think the President should be the deciding factor in whether you enlist or not. Sure they can inspire you to do your part for your country, but I honestly can't see how they can discourage you. But as I said, that was warman so who really knows what he thinks.
I didnt read every page, but what I can say is that:
IMO, the Iraq War wasnt the best option, but as the White House says, they had their motives and intel to mount an invasion. It just turned out that they were wrong.
-and-
Jesus, I facepalmed so fucking hard at your points. You also stated that the US hadnt had a threat of invasion or real war since WWII. OKAY, WHAT THE FUCK SON. Have you heard of the Cold War, Vietnam, Korea, spread of communism, domino effect, political instability of other governments? Have you graduated grade 9 social science? Shit man, after WWII, we (the Western powers) were threatened of the spread of Chinese and Russian communism, otherwise known as the domino effect. One of the prime reasons for the Vietnam war was to prevent Russia/China from having a larger front to fight with just incase the Cold War hit the fucking fan. Fortunately enough, Vietnam was sick of China's bullshit and beat their army in the 1979 China invasion of Vietnam.
-and-
OP is a fucking retard for blaming soldiers/servicemen/women. You blame them for protecting your freedom, your liberties, and your free speech? I dont even know what youre going on about them for, they're doing a service for the greater good of their country, as any soldier does. How can you even attack them for that?
End of rage/rant at OP (also, in the case that you have missed it, I skipped half of page 2 and onwards)
IMO, the Iraq War wasnt the best option, but as the White House says, they had their motives and intel to mount an invasion. It just turned out that they were wrong.
-and-
Jesus, I facepalmed so fucking hard at your points. You also stated that the US hadnt had a threat of invasion or real war since WWII. OKAY, WHAT THE FUCK SON. Have you heard of the Cold War, Vietnam, Korea, spread of communism, domino effect, political instability of other governments? Have you graduated grade 9 social science? Shit man, after WWII, we (the Western powers) were threatened of the spread of Chinese and Russian communism, otherwise known as the domino effect. One of the prime reasons for the Vietnam war was to prevent Russia/China from having a larger front to fight with just incase the Cold War hit the fucking fan. Fortunately enough, Vietnam was sick of China's bullshit and beat their army in the 1979 China invasion of Vietnam.
-and-
OP is a fucking retard for blaming soldiers/servicemen/women. You blame them for protecting your freedom, your liberties, and your free speech? I dont even know what youre going on about them for, they're doing a service for the greater good of their country, as any soldier does. How can you even attack them for that?
End of rage/rant at OP (also, in the case that you have missed it, I skipped half of page 2 and onwards)
noice 
Sending more young men and women to their deaths than actually died at the event they are "avenging", in the wrong country is plain stupid. But that's the administration. You can hardly blame impressionable young ppl for getting lured into the military cult. When all the media and culture around them is telling them its honorable and patriotic to sign up and go and protect the rich elite's interests overseas. Seams plenty of ppl on here subscribe to that bullshit.
The argument that we need army's is bullshit. The only countries who have big armies are those with old or new imperialist intentions. Drop them and you can scale back the huge army's.
I can't remember who said it...but "your mother and sister getting raped" if a huge military isn't maintain is la la fantasy bullshit. The same bullshit that's used to justify spending sickening amounts on military while roughly 12% to 16% of Americans are living below the federal poverty line.
How the fuck are an army of rapists going to land on US soil? totally laughable.
I would sign up to the military if I thought my country was under attack. The media and government hysteria which followed 9/11 portrayed America as under attack. Ppl bought it and signed up. You can't really blame them for doing what they perceive to be right. Protecting their country. That's why I support the troops, but not the mission.
The argument that we need army's is bullshit. The only countries who have big armies are those with old or new imperialist intentions. Drop them and you can scale back the huge army's.
I can't remember who said it...but "your mother and sister getting raped" if a huge military isn't maintain is la la fantasy bullshit. The same bullshit that's used to justify spending sickening amounts on military while roughly 12% to 16% of Americans are living below the federal poverty line.
How the fuck are an army of rapists going to land on US soil? totally laughable.
I would sign up to the military if I thought my country was under attack. The media and government hysteria which followed 9/11 portrayed America as under attack. Ppl bought it and signed up. You can't really blame them for doing what they perceive to be right. Protecting their country. That's why I support the troops, but not the mission.
You can support the troops while disagreeing with the war and questioning why your country needs such a big army.
Many join out of idealistic intentions, which is commendable.
OTOH No-one gets my respect solely because they joined up.
Enough fuckwits join the Police so they can bully and intimidate their way to 'respect', I don't doubt the military is any different.
We seem to be in the same situation as after the Vietnam war, returning veterans demand respect for having fought in a war no-one wanted and which was of zero benefit to their country.
Then they formed biker gangs looking for cameraderie and respect, now they trawl videogame forums looking for impressionable kids to awe.
Many join out of idealistic intentions, which is commendable.
OTOH No-one gets my respect solely because they joined up.
Enough fuckwits join the Police so they can bully and intimidate their way to 'respect', I don't doubt the military is any different.
We seem to be in the same situation as after the Vietnam war, returning veterans demand respect for having fought in a war no-one wanted and which was of zero benefit to their country.
Then they formed biker gangs looking for cameraderie and respect, now they trawl videogame forums looking for impressionable kids to awe.
Last edited by Dilbert_X (2008-12-23 04:47:40)
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
You can believe that if you want to.Kustav wrote:
IMO, the Iraq War wasnt the best option, but as the White House says, they had their motives and intel to mount an invasion. It just turned out that they were wrong.
Cold war was fought by both sides.Kustav wrote:
Have you heard of the Cold War, Vietnam, Korea, spread of communism, domino effect, political instability of other governments?
Vietnam - totally pointless war of choice
Korea - not sure what the point was
Domino effect - turned out to be a faulty theory
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
So you are saying a mechanic named Todd shouldn't go all the way with his mom? pfft. I reject your view and re-substitute my own. Todd is in.TheAussieReaper wrote:
I agree with everything you said up to this point tbh deez.deeznutz1245 wrote:
You are an ignorant fuck.cpt.fass1 wrote:
...... these are the people that didn't want to further their education or who basically couldn't provide for them self in our society. So they joined the military......
And a lot of the time you can further your education through a military career. It isn't just swinging a gun over your shoulders and marching around the desert, for a start - despite what you might think cpt.fass.
Malloy must go
Its a fact a lot of people join the military to get an education they couldn't otherwise get, or couldn't get any kind of reliable work.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
you are way too stupid to run your own business if you think you would not have been drafted in 2001 if the military was smaller and non-voluntary.ATG wrote:
quote for motherfuckingtruth.Turquoise wrote:
I can agree with some of what fass is saying. We really do spend too much on the military and enter too many conflicts. There are a few people in the military that I've known that are serious douchebags (I can think of one recently permabanned member here in particular).
Still, I wouldn't go so far as to assume that assholes are the norm. While it is true that a lot of people join the military out of financial need, I can respect this choice because of the danger they're putting themselves in for a pretty low pay and low benefits.
The main reason I'd never join the military myself though is that I don't trust this government. So, on the one hand, I think we should support people who put their lives at risk with the intention of protecting us, but on the other hand, we should recognize that the government they work for is far more interested in profiting off of their deaths than in protecting us.
That's how I see it anyway.
The troops are mostly honorable, but the politicians leading them should be the ones getting blown up instead.What a load of horseshit.usmarine wrote:
well lets look back to people who joined in the late 90's. if they hadnt volunteered, you would have been drafted in 2001 (assuming you were old enough).
If the spineless fuckwits had the balls they would have instituted a draft instead of paying touthless douchebags like those that work for blackwater and private companies servicing aircraft ( sorry lowing ) double, triple and more what enlists swinging dicks make.
Or, if the brainless idiots in the whitehouse had had any fucking integrity they would have counted the cost of the war into our yearly budget, which they don't. This whole war is made of fail and the sad sacks going of to die for it have been suckered in an eternal way.
Fass is preaching from the church of painful truth boys. It may have been stated in overly harsh language but all in all his logic has dominated this thread.
I support the troops and job training for them so they can do something better with their time than fighting and dying for cocksuckers like Cheney and Bush.
Big budget cuts for the military are coming. These troops will come home to a jiggered economy wherein nobody is hiring unless you want to work at Walmart or McDonalds. I expect there will be a few patriots who will go on the warpath after seeing what they are returning to. Sad, really. Every part of this mess.
A mechanic named Barbara would be more apt.deeznutz1245 wrote:
So you are saying a mechanic named Todd shouldn't go all the way with his mom? pfft. I reject your view and re-substitute my own. Todd is in.
When I first started uni one of my opinions was to do my degree but sign up with the army, navy or airforce who would then provide the textbooks and hecs fees money (which for me is about $30,000au) in total. In essence a free uni education.Dilbert_X wrote:
Its a fact a lot of people join the military to get an education they couldn't otherwise get, or couldn't get any kind of reliable work.
However, in return after completion of the degree I would the have to spend at least 3 years in the armed forces and on whatever wage they pay all recruits. I weighed up the option and figured it certainly wasn't worth it, for some I can see how it would be temping.
Reasons why I didn't join the military...
1. The recruiter seemed like the fat chick at the bar, always popping up where I was, to talk to me. Calling me at my house and being just overly aggressive.
2. I didn't want to sign my life away and not be able to make choices for myself.. Didn't want to be put in the position of compromising my morals for command.
3. This is the most important one for me.. The Military boys are a step up from the animal testing that pharmaceuticals use, before a drug goes into population it gets tested on the military men/women first..
So I did my research before signing my name and proving that I can do 20 push ups and 30 sit ups..
I support our troops, the ones that have and will stand up against command without fear of penalty to do what they feel is right.. As have been proven time and time again in this thread is "Fuck you man, you said bad things about all military, you're a pussy", which shows an undieing sense of worth just by serving.
I never said the military is bankrupting our government, I said that they're are many unqualified men and women in our armed service and if they're making 19k a year they're costing us 100k a year.. It's not like other jobs where they live off their income and if they can't make ends meet they have to change they're life style. Nope they get housing, they get food, clothing, education and provided for. I do have some friends in the military and they shit bricks when Obama was elected because of Military cuts. One of my conversations with him went,
"well sorry man, that's life we as a country aren't doing too well. I just hope that if you get cut, you can find a real job out there"
"Fuck that man I've served this country, I don't want to look for a civilian job"
"It sucks but more then likely your wife is going to have to find a job too, times are tough and if you do enter civilian life you're probably going to have to go to a two income family" (they have four kids)
"I don't like your condescending voice, I'll be able to find a job to support my family by myself"
"OK man good luck with that"
He was pissed and I haven't talked to him since.
1. The recruiter seemed like the fat chick at the bar, always popping up where I was, to talk to me. Calling me at my house and being just overly aggressive.
2. I didn't want to sign my life away and not be able to make choices for myself.. Didn't want to be put in the position of compromising my morals for command.
3. This is the most important one for me.. The Military boys are a step up from the animal testing that pharmaceuticals use, before a drug goes into population it gets tested on the military men/women first..
So I did my research before signing my name and proving that I can do 20 push ups and 30 sit ups..
I support our troops, the ones that have and will stand up against command without fear of penalty to do what they feel is right.. As have been proven time and time again in this thread is "Fuck you man, you said bad things about all military, you're a pussy", which shows an undieing sense of worth just by serving.
I never said the military is bankrupting our government, I said that they're are many unqualified men and women in our armed service and if they're making 19k a year they're costing us 100k a year.. It's not like other jobs where they live off their income and if they can't make ends meet they have to change they're life style. Nope they get housing, they get food, clothing, education and provided for. I do have some friends in the military and they shit bricks when Obama was elected because of Military cuts. One of my conversations with him went,
"well sorry man, that's life we as a country aren't doing too well. I just hope that if you get cut, you can find a real job out there"
"Fuck that man I've served this country, I don't want to look for a civilian job"
"It sucks but more then likely your wife is going to have to find a job too, times are tough and if you do enter civilian life you're probably going to have to go to a two income family" (they have four kids)
"I don't like your condescending voice, I'll be able to find a job to support my family by myself"
"OK man good luck with that"
He was pissed and I haven't talked to him since.
Gee, I wonder why.cpt.fass1 wrote:
We haven't had a threat of Invasion or a real War since WWII...
So you don't have to.cpt.fass1 wrote:
[...] it was his choice to serve
Leech?cpt.fass1 wrote:
like it was my choice to do what I do..
Could you break that down into a comprehensible sentence?cpt.fass1 wrote:
Don't know, maybe since we should our willingness to use nukes?
OK, I'm not skimming this anymore. If you think military personnel can't lose their jobs, you're drunk.cpt.fass1 wrote:
You signed up for a service it's a job like any other job, ok not like any other job because you really can't get fired.
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2008-12-23 07:15:51)
Don't know, maybe since we show'd our willingness to use nukes?unnamednewbie13 wrote:
Gee, I wonder why.cpt.fass1 wrote:
We haven't had a threat of Invasion or a real War since WWII...
Sorry mistype..
Last edited by cpt.fass1 (2008-12-23 07:49:27)
Cpt.Fass1, by the tone of your original post, it really sounds as if the quote below describes something that happened to you;
"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." - General Tommy Franks
"When you men get home and face an anti-war protester, look him in the eyes and shake his hand. Then, wink at his girlfriend, because she knows she's dating a pussy." - General Tommy Franks
Yes and remember that you are the top of the evolutionary ladder
I can use picture as well to prove a point that all it takes to join the military is a signature..
Really is there something wrong with saying that we just can't blindly support our troops anymore.. We need a smaller force that is actually better equipted and will protect the American PEOPLE, not the Companies Interests.
I can use picture as well to prove a point that all it takes to join the military is a signature..
Really is there something wrong with saying that we just can't blindly support our troops anymore.. We need a smaller force that is actually better equipted and will protect the American PEOPLE, not the Companies Interests.
Last edited by cpt.fass1 (2008-12-23 07:54:01)
The military should be smaller and non-voluntary.usmarine wrote:
you are way too stupid to run your own business if you think you would not have been drafted in 2001 if the military was smaller and non-voluntary.
Senators sons should be on the front lines in all theaters.
The troops go where the civilian leadership sends them. If you don't like where the military is going, you, as a private citizen, need to vote different congressmen, senators, and presidents into power.cpt.fass1 wrote:
Really is there something wrong with saying that we just can't blindly support our troops anymore.. We need a smaller force that is actually better equipted and will protect the American PEOPLE, not the Companies Interests.
The troops do not make policy. They are given orders to accomplish a goal, and are given the equipment that congress decides they need.
This, quite often, is akin to "Here's a Crayon and a roll of toilet paper - write me a novel comparable to War & Peace"
Now, your argument I quoted above is fairly reasonable. Many (if not most) military personnel would agree with it.
(minus the lack of distinction between the Troops and the Civilian Leadership)
Your original post, however, is ... Troll bait.
And, please, remove the picture of the Bride of Frankenstein & her R.O.T.C love-slave. That's just ... gross.
(Note: ROTC insignia on the uniform.. that there is one of "your" college boys who wants to be a soldier after he gets a degree)
Last edited by rdx-fx (2008-12-23 08:17:50)
Oh, hell no.ATG wrote:
The military should be smaller and non-voluntary.usmarine wrote:
you are way too stupid to run your own business if you think you would not have been drafted in 2001 if the military was smaller and non-voluntary.
We do NOT want kids like Cpt.Fass1 with our volunteer soldiers. There is enough bitching and griping during a deployment without having draftees around.
Thank you for an actual reasonable argument.. Where I understand about our leadership, don't you take a oath to protect the constitution?
I read time and time again in this forum, people who are for limiting rights for protection, which is exactly what you fight to protect. It doesn't seem to make any sense, to run around and say fuck you I protect your freedom, but then back up things like the patriot act?
Yeah cause I"m a trust fund, living off mommy and daddy getting my girl friends stolen cause I"m a pussy uneducated asshole?
Remember I have a choice in who I vote to be your leader, you don't have a choice who you want to follow..
I read time and time again in this forum, people who are for limiting rights for protection, which is exactly what you fight to protect. It doesn't seem to make any sense, to run around and say fuck you I protect your freedom, but then back up things like the patriot act?
Yeah cause I"m a trust fund, living off mommy and daddy getting my girl friends stolen cause I"m a pussy uneducated asshole?
Remember I have a choice in who I vote to be your leader, you don't have a choice who you want to follow..
Last edited by cpt.fass1 (2008-12-23 08:33:35)
LOL, ROTC.cpt.fass1 wrote:
Yes and remember that you are the top of the evolutionary ladder
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b84/k … litary.jpg
I can use picture as well to prove a point that all it takes to join the military is a signature..
Really is there something wrong with saying that we just can't blindly support our troops anymore.. We need a smaller force that is actually better equipted and will protect the American PEOPLE, not the Companies Interests.
My Aunt/2 cousins/friends all use to/do wear that uniform to high school once a week for 4 years. Hell I could probably get one of those uniforms or even some camo clothing+airsoft guns and get some bum from the street to put them on and you would probably believe it.
Last edited by 12/f/taiwan (2008-12-23 09:20:30)
Yes, we do.cpt.fass1 wrote:
Thank you for an actual reasonable argument.. Where I understand about our leadership, don't you take a oath to protect the constitution?
So, all the civilians need to stop electing assholes and idiots to the Constitutionally mandated national offices. Like President, Congress, etc.
Now, if you impeach a consitutionally elected official and he refuses to leave - then you can call on the military to get rid of his happy ass. The military does, in fact, work for the People of the USA... but historically this is done by following the orders of elected Representatives.
The US military has done such an outstanding job keeping the fighting, dying, and bloodshed outside of our borders for so long - that we have a generation of kids like cpt.fass1 here who have no idea how valuable of a service that really is.
If you want an example of what happens to nations with a weak military, look to Kuwait circa 1990 - or France circa 1940's. Great economy, great natural resource, lousy military. A stronger neighbor decided he wanted what they had - and took it by force. With no regard for justice, legality, reason, or fairness.
THAT is why we have such a strong military.
Some kids join the military for 4 years, because they can't think of anything better to do with themselves at the time - and the military will pay for a college degree for them once they do figure out what they want to do with themselves. Pretty good deal, really.
The career soldier, in many cases, does it for a completely different reason. To put it bluntly, we've seen what a shithole the rest of the world can be - and we're willing to risk our lives to make sure our wives, children, and friends can remain blithely unaware of how nasty, brutal, unjust, dangerous, and generally shitty the rest of the world can be.
It is most definitely NOT because they are capable of nothing better. The career military people I know have at least one college degree, (often a masters or better), literally years of training in military classrooms & courses (Adding up just the military courses I've been to as a non-commissioned officer = 120 weeks for the main courses = 2 years & 4 months of nothing but military courses, before you start adding in civilian courses taken for 'professional developement' and promotion points).
Enjoy your safe McDonalds and Walmart existence.
You owe it to the wisdom & foresight of the Founders of this country, the Industry of the People, and the blood and Lives of the Soldiers that defend it.
Now, for one of your other complaints. No, soldiers don't have the right to blow-jobs on demand from any passing civilian. (As much as we'd like to convince some of the USO girls .. sadly, this is not something congress has authorized). I'm told this is covered by the 3rd Amendment, but.. I'm not seeing the interpretation they're pulling this from. </joke>
Last edited by rdx-fx (2008-12-23 10:09:06)
Drafts are bad because volunteers almost always make better soldiers than draftees.ATG wrote:
What a load of horseshit.usmarine wrote:
well lets look back to people who joined in the late 90's. if they hadnt volunteered, you would have been drafted in 2001 (assuming you were old enough).
If the spineless fuckwits had the balls they would have instituted a draft instead of paying touthless douchebags like those that work for blackwater and private companies servicing aircraft ( sorry lowing ) double, triple and more what enlists swinging dicks make.
Or, if the brainless idiots in the whitehouse had had any fucking integrity they would have counted the cost of the war into our yearly budget, which they don't. This whole war is made of fail and the sad sacks going of to die for it have been suckered in an eternal way.
Fass is preaching from the church of painful truth boys. It may have been stated in overly harsh language but all in all his logic has dominated this thread.
I support the troops and job training for them so they can do something better with their time than fighting and dying for cocksuckers like Cheney and Bush.
Big budget cuts for the military are coming. These troops will come home to a jiggered economy wherein nobody is hiring unless you want to work at Walmart or McDonalds. I expect there will be a few patriots who will go on the warpath after seeing what they are returning to. Sad, really. Every part of this mess.
Still, I would agree that the level of contracting we've done with this war has been absurd. Initially, the assumption was that contractors would save the government money in the long run by not having as many personnel connected to government benefits that come with being a member of the military.
The problem is that these assumptions were based on employing a much smaller number of contractors than the amount that ended up being sent to places like Iraq and Afghanistan. We've thoroughly crossed the point of no return when it comes to any savings we could've made by hiring out these jobs to contractors. It would've been much much cheaper and more effective to have simply expanded the military payroll to fill the various contracting jobs than to have spent so much on contractors.
So I guess, in this respect, I can say that I do support a larger military, just not in the way that most people think of when they hear that phrase.
The point is... if you're going to invade and nationbuild a country -- do it with your own military forces. There should be minimal private sector involvement.
thats ROTC (COLLEGE) you nub. what point are you trying to prove? please go die. thank you.cpt.fass1 wrote:
Yes and remember that you are the top of the evolutionary ladder
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b84/k … litary.jpg
I can use picture as well to prove a point that all it takes to join the military is a signature..
Really is there something wrong with saying that we just can't blindly support our troops anymore.. We need a smaller force that is actually better equipted and will protect the American PEOPLE, not the Companies Interests.
Last edited by usmarine (2008-12-23 15:24:00)
and you bitch about contractors now? lol. you need to make up your mind. just once. you flip flop more then a fish on land.ATG wrote:
The military should be smaller and non-voluntary.