Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6347|eXtreme to the maX

SAN4 wrote:

Hamas has said they do not want to negotiate and they have never done so.
Hamas is prepared to negotiate
http://www.breakingnews.ie/archives/200 … wsneykfau/

The majority of Israelis are ready to negotiate with Hamas
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/ … /27/hamas/

Israel has been negotiating with Hamas already.
http://www.israeltoday.co.il/default.as … ;nid=16877
http://www.ynet.co.il/english/articles/ … 41,00.html
http://www.commongroundnews.org/article … 0&sp=0

Everyone here needs to stop playing political games and hiding behind gesture politics and just sort it out.
Fuck Israel
san4
The Mas
+311|6929|NYC, a place to live

Dilbert_X wrote:

SAN4 wrote:

Hamas has said they do not want to negotiate and they have never done so.
Hamas is prepared to negotiate
http://www.breakingnews.ie/archives/200 … wsneykfau/
That's not a fair reading of the article, which really says Hamas is not willing to negotiate peace. It says the group's official position has not changed, that its goal continues to be destroying Israel and replacing it with an Islamic state, and that negotiations would be a means to this end. The article points out that Hamas could change its official charter but had not, and it has not done so in the three years since, nor has there ever been a movement within the group to do so. The article is based on one vague statement by one Hamas official. The fact that you can't find a clearer or more recent statement that Hamas will accept anything less than the total eradication of Israel is pretty good evidence that their position is the position they've stated clearly and repeatedly: the destruction of Israel is not negotiable.

Dilbert_X wrote:

The majority of Israelis are ready to negotiate with Hamas
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/ … /27/hamas/
The sound of one hand clapping.

The talks have mostly been about prisoner exchanges and a temporary truce. It's not bad for the sides to talk, but Hamas has said it will not negotiate about letting Israel exist.

Dilbert_X wrote:

Everyone here needs to stop playing political games and hiding behind gesture politics and just sort it out.
Actually, there seems to be a lot of agreement in this thread. Pretty much everyone, including the rabid people, agree that Hamas has to change its position before there can be peace. The main disagreement is how to get Hamas to change its position. Some people seem to be saying that changing Israel's behavior and cutting off US aid to Israel will get Hamas to change its position. The problem is Hamas has never made its position contingent on US aid, Israeli actions or anything else.

I'm saying, if Hamas has to change its position before peace can happen, focus on Hamas and get it to change its position. At least get them to set some conditions. Are they such savages that Europe can't talk to them and convince them to consider peace? Are they such bloodthirsty religious fanatics that the world can't bribe them to consider peace? Can we cut off Hamas' source of weapons and funding to prevent them from disrupting a peace agreement made by others? There can't be peace if a heavily armed, violent group says it will never agree to peace.
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6892|USA

san4 wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

SAN4 wrote:

Hamas has said they do not want to negotiate and they have never done so.
Hamas is prepared to negotiate
http://www.breakingnews.ie/archives/200 … wsneykfau/
That's not a fair reading of the article, which really says Hamas is not willing to negotiate peace. It says the group's official position has not changed, that its goal continues to be destroying Israel and replacing it with an Islamic state, and that negotiations would be a means to this end. The article points out that Hamas could change its official charter but had not, and it has not done so in the three years since, nor has there ever been a movement within the group to do so. The article is based on one vague statement by one Hamas official. The fact that you can't find a clearer or more recent statement that Hamas will accept anything less than the total eradication of Israel is pretty good evidence that their position is the position they've stated clearly and repeatedly: the destruction of Israel is not negotiable.

Dilbert_X wrote:

The majority of Israelis are ready to negotiate with Hamas
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/ … /27/hamas/
The sound of one hand clapping.

The talks have mostly been about prisoner exchanges and a temporary truce. It's not bad for the sides to talk, but Hamas has said it will not negotiate about letting Israel exist.

Dilbert_X wrote:

Everyone here needs to stop playing political games and hiding behind gesture politics and just sort it out.
Actually, there seems to be a lot of agreement in this thread. Pretty much everyone, including the rabid people, agree that Hamas has to change its position before there can be peace. The main disagreement is how to get Hamas to change its position. Some people seem to be saying that changing Israel's behavior and cutting off US aid to Israel will get Hamas to change its position. The problem is Hamas has never made its position contingent on US aid, Israeli actions or anything else.

I'm saying, if Hamas has to change its position before peace can happen, focus on Hamas and get it to change its position. At least get them to set some conditions. Are they such savages that Europe can't talk to them and convince them to consider peace? Are they such bloodthirsty religious fanatics that the world can't bribe them to consider peace? Can we cut off Hamas' source of weapons and funding to prevent them from disrupting a peace agreement made by others? There can't be peace if a heavily armed, violent group says it will never agree to peace.
I know how to get Hamas to change.....Take the leash off of Israel and turn them loose unhindered and let them kick the fuck outta Hamas and be done with it. Then Israel can kick the shit outta any other takers, just like they did before when the region that started a war with Israel was left begging the UN to stop Israel from destroying everyone of those fuckhead nations

Last edited by lowing (2008-12-13 12:50:26)

san4
The Mas
+311|6929|NYC, a place to live
The cavalry has arrived.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6347|eXtreme to the maX

SAN4 wrote:

There can't be peace if a heavily armed, violent group says it will never agree to peace.
Hence the need to reign in Israel.
Whats the most Hamas has, AK47s and RPGs?
Doesn't really compare with Merkava tanks, F16s and Apache gunships.

Lowing wrote:

Take the leash off of Israel and turn them loose unhindered and let them kick the fuck outta Hamas and be done with it.
I have a better idea, lets make Israel change, give tactical nuclear weapons to Hamas and watch the Israel start abiding by the UN resolutions like its supposed to.
Fuck Israel
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6464|Escea

Dilbert_X wrote:

give tactical nuclear weapons to Hamas.
Boy that'd be sensible
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6892|USA

Dilbert_X wrote:

SAN4 wrote:

There can't be peace if a heavily armed, violent group says it will never agree to peace.
Hence the need to reign in Israel.
Whats the most Hamas has, AK47s and RPGs?
Doesn't really compare with Merkava tanks, F16s and Apache gunships.

Lowing wrote:

Take the leash off of Israel and turn them loose unhindered and let them kick the fuck outta Hamas and be done with it.
I have a better idea, lets make Israel change, give tactical nuclear weapons to Hamas and watch the Israel start abiding by the UN resolutions like its supposed to.
Sorry the bottomline is. Israel is no threat to western civilization. Can't say much about the rest of them
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6347|eXtreme to the maX

Lowing wrote:

Sorry the bottomline is. Israel is no threat to western civilization. Can't say much about the rest of them
The Palestinians aren't a threat to Western civilisation, just Israel.
Israel is basically the problem, its why the ME has been stirred up.
Don't remember any Islamic terrorism directed at the West before Israel was created.
Fuck Israel
Lisik
Member
+74|6741|Israel
^^ lol

For Europeans it must be a standard to blame Jews for their fuck ups.

Last edited by Lisik (2008-12-13 13:09:38)

san4
The Mas
+311|6929|NYC, a place to live

Dilbert_X wrote:

SAN4 wrote:

There can't be peace if a heavily armed, violent group says it will never agree to peace.
Hence the need to reign in Israel.
Israel has said it will agree to peace, engaged in peace negotiations, made offers, given up territory, and made peace treaties with former enemies.

Only someone who is willfully blind could characterize Israel as a group that says it will never agree to peace.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6347|eXtreme to the maX
Only someone who is willfully blind could characterize Israel as a group that says it will never agree to peace.
Israelis want peace on their terms alone, otherwise they aren't interested.
Fuck Israel
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6464|Escea

Dilbert_X wrote:

Only someone who is willfully blind could characterize Israel as a group that says it will never agree to peace.
Israelis want peace on their terms alone, otherwise they aren't interested.
Hamas has a nice solution for both do they?
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6347|eXtreme to the maX
Neither has a workable solution right now, as I've said repeatedly.
To say Hamas are pure evil and the Israelis are sweetness and light is wrong however.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2008-12-13 13:23:02)

Fuck Israel
san4
The Mas
+311|6929|NYC, a place to live

Dilbert_X wrote:

Only someone who is willfully blind could characterize Israel as a group that says it will never agree to peace.
Israelis want peace on their terms alone, otherwise they aren't interested.
You are just quibbling with Israel's negotiating positions. Israel is clearly willing to negotiate the terms of a peace. Hamas is clearly not. Whether they can reach a compromise acceptable to both sides is something we cannot know until Hamas agrees to try to negotiate a peace agreement.
Little BaBy JESUS
m8
+394|6389|'straya

lowing wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

SAN4 wrote:

There can't be peace if a heavily armed, violent group says it will never agree to peace.
Hence the need to reign in Israel.
Whats the most Hamas has, AK47s and RPGs?
Doesn't really compare with Merkava tanks, F16s and Apache gunships.

Lowing wrote:

Take the leash off of Israel and turn them loose unhindered and let them kick the fuck outta Hamas and be done with it.
I have a better idea, lets make Israel change, give tactical nuclear weapons to Hamas and watch the Israel start abiding by the UN resolutions like its supposed to.
Sorry the bottomline is. Israel is no threat to western civilization. Can't say much about the rest of them
Lol so palestinian suicide bombers that cant get out of their country because their blockaded by Israel are more of a threat than Israel who has ignored countless UN resolutions, has nuclear weapons, wont let the UN inspect their nuclear weapons....

Oh i can see how palestine are more of a threat than Israel going rouge

Last edited by Little BaBy JESUS (2008-12-13 16:56:17)

usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7002

Little BaBy JESUS wrote:

Lol so palestinian suicide bombers that cant get out of their country because their blockaded by Israel
ummm...thats the point.  wouldnt you block suicide bombers?
Little BaBy JESUS
m8
+394|6389|'straya

usmarine wrote:

Little BaBy JESUS wrote:

Lol so palestinian suicide bombers that cant get out of their country because their blockaded by Israel
ummm...thats the point.  wouldnt you block suicide bombers?
Yes but how are they a threat to the western world? that the remark i was addressing
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7002

Little BaBy JESUS wrote:

usmarine wrote:

Little BaBy JESUS wrote:

Lol so palestinian suicide bombers that cant get out of their country because their blockaded by Israel
ummm...thats the point.  wouldnt you block suicide bombers?
Yes but how are they a threat to the western world? that the remark i was addressing
because they dont just stay in the ME.  i could be wrong, but i thought i read some stories a while back about hamas in south america or something.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6347|eXtreme to the maX
i read some stories a while back about hamas in south america or something.
Wow, sounds like a serious threat to the Western world.
Fuck Israel
Little BaBy JESUS
m8
+394|6389|'straya

usmarine wrote:

Little BaBy JESUS wrote:

usmarine wrote:


ummm...thats the point.  wouldnt you block suicide bombers?
Yes but how are they a threat to the western world? that the remark i was addressing
because they dont just stay in the ME.  i could be wrong, but i thought i read some stories a while back about hamas in south america or something.
i doubt they came from palestine though... many palestinians are cut off from relatives or workplaces or hospitals by the israeli wall and illegal settlements... let alone get to another continent.
AutralianChainsaw
Member
+65|6439

Lisik wrote:

^^ lol

For Europeans it must be a standard to blame Jews for their fuck ups.
Who talked about jews ?  We are talking about israel..
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7002

Dilbert_X wrote:

i read some stories a while back about hamas in south america or something.
Wow, sounds like a serious threat to the Western world.
didnt say that did i?  nope.  all is said was they are not just in palestine.
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7002

AutralianChainsaw wrote:

Lisik wrote:

^^ lol

For Europeans it must be a standard to blame Jews for their fuck ups.
Who talked about jews ?  We are talking about israel..
yes but you are a nazi so it doesnt matter what you say.
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6770|Global Command
I hope you guys realize that rammunition will probably create one new thread for every page this topic goes...

Just saying.
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7002

ATG wrote:

I hope you guys realize that rammunition will probably create one new thread for every page this topic goes...

Just saying.
yes but nobody listens to him anymore.

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