BEE_Grim_Reaper
Member
+15|6757|Germany

Spark wrote:

I'll just leave Reaper to do the talking, he knows more than me. And he has more patience.

--

chuckle_hound wrote:

yuck7777 wrote:

How France does the unthinkable? The war in Iraq has yelded infomation that France since the end of the first gulf war was supplying Saddam with over $20 billion worth of military equipment and spare parts which were smuggled in through Siria. In exchange France got 23% of the Iraqis oil. All this while Iraq was under sanctions from the UN. And of couse they didn't back the Iraq war, Because it would make them lose the sweet deal they had.
Now with Iran. The French have been investing alot of money in Iran. The Big automotive companies have invested a big chunk of money there.
How can we trust France in there talks with Iran over the nukes? Should we boycott France? Should the US and there true Allies label France as a terrorist supporter or even a Terriorist state?
What do you think?
My god!  That's awful.  A country that supports known terrorists.  That manipulates the world in such a way as to get the best deal.  Next thing you'll be telling me that they illegally invaded another country and incarcerated innocent people outside of the law.  I mean if they did that it'd be bad enough, but what happens if they had a leader who was so incompetent he had to ASK his staff to go to the toilet.

I'm looking forward to Iran opening up their oil market to Europe properly, should start to balance the world out and help us say adios to the dollar

Why it would be chaos.


I have a sudden urge to cosh you round the back of the head and ask you to fetch my slippers.  Which is silly, because I already have a retarded twerp to do that for me.  Ah well, two's better than one.
Read the rest of the topic and you'll see that issue was closed a long time ago
Yup...the original topic of this thread has died long ago... we now should call it "The multithematic thread... come on in and have fun"
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6725|Canberra, AUS
You mean Dresden? Which was bombed to splinters by the USAF? And a few hundred thousand dead? On a festival day?
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
BEE_Grim_Reaper
Member
+15|6757|Germany

Spark wrote:

You mean Dresden? Which was bombed to splinters by the USAF? And a few hundred thousand dead? On a festival day?
Well... not only Dresden, though this is one splendid example...
Also Hamburg, where the bombings created a Firestorm lasting a week
Or Cologne, where the only building left nearly unscathed was the Dome... the rest being more or less flat rubble... and there was not one piece of industrial facilities in the centre of that city (even now there isn't).

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes... The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone.... and not all of them exploded.... when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.
TheMajorBummer
Have a nice day!
+-4|6875|Netherlands

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Spark wrote:

You mean Dresden? Which was bombed to splinters by the USAF? And a few hundred thousand dead? On a festival day?
Well... not only Dresden, though this is one splendid example...
Also Hamburg, where the bombings created a Firestorm lasting a week
Or Cologne, where the only building left nearly unscathed was the Dome... the rest being more or less flat rubble... and there was not one piece of industrial facilities in the centre of that city (even now there isn't).

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes... The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone.... and not all of them exploded.... when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.
wie wind zaait zal storm oogsten.

koekje van eigen deeg.
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6891|Cologne, Germany

TheMajorBummer wrote:

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Spark wrote:

You mean Dresden? Which was bombed to splinters by the USAF? And a few hundred thousand dead? On a festival day?
Well... not only Dresden, though this is one splendid example...
Also Hamburg, where the bombings created a Firestorm lasting a week
Or Cologne, where the only building left nearly unscathed was the Dome... the rest being more or less flat rubble... and there was not one piece of industrial facilities in the centre of that city (even now there isn't).

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes... The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone.... and not all of them exploded.... when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.
wie wind zaait zal storm oogsten.

koekje van eigen deeg.
oh, really ?

how nice of you to say that. Let's not breed any more dutch-german hatred, shall we ?
BEE_Grim_Reaper
Member
+15|6757|Germany

B.Schuss wrote:

TheMajorBummer wrote:

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:


Well... not only Dresden, though this is one splendid example...
Also Hamburg, where the bombings created a Firestorm lasting a week
Or Cologne, where the only building left nearly unscathed was the Dome... the rest being more or less flat rubble... and there was not one piece of industrial facilities in the centre of that city (even now there isn't).

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes... The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone.... and not all of them exploded.... when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.
wie wind zaait zal storm oogsten.

koekje van eigen deeg.
oh, really ?

how nice of you to say that. Let's not breed any more dutch-german hatred, shall we ?
Agreed.... that whole WWII thing was a very bad idea from the start... especially the start in 1933. I mean... Germany had it coming after levelling Rotterdam and Coventry and all the atrocities being committed....

My actual point was: It is a big difference suffering from war in a country that never experienced enemy activity within its own boarder or suffering from war while either living in a hailstorm of bombs or being occupied by hostile forces.
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6887
I thought the Brits did dresden am I not correct ?
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6887
And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes...

( This is pretty silly to comment on, all it means is "thats the best they could do"
They would have dropped 687,897,000.76 million tons if they'd had the ability )

The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone....

( There was something of a WAR on, )

and not all of them exploded.... ( Hey We tried at least.)

when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.     

( Carefull with that shovel ! )

Well you should  Be Nice from now on. last I checked we never gassed anyone.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6725|Canberra, AUS

Horseman 77 wrote:

I thought the Brits did dresden am I not correct ?
More info at (where else) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of … ld_War_II.

Both did. And did it good, too.

One of many major bombing campaigns on German cities.

Last edited by Spark (2006-01-27 23:51:21)

The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
Greenie_Beazinie
Aussie Outlaw
+8|6863
Sure takes a good military to bomb a civie city
BEE_Grim_Reaper
Member
+15|6757|Germany

Horseman 77 wrote:

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes...

( This is pretty silly to comment on, all it means is "thats the best they could do"
They would have dropped 687,897,000.76 million tons if they'd had the ability )

The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone....

( There was something of a WAR on, )

and not all of them exploded.... ( Hey We tried at least.)

when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.     

( Carefull with that shovel ! )

Well you should  Be Nice from now on. last I checked we never gassed anyone.
You're right... Germany could not do better... as matter of fact, the reason is because the Luftwaffe was completely designed for ground support and air superiority but was without a strategic ar.

As for "There was something of a WAR on".... There is definitely a difference between bombing strategic targets and bombing civilian non-com targets into rubble. On the other hand, the phrase "collateral damage" (aka civilian casualties) was not yet in use.

As a matter of fact, we are nice now since we do not have a Hitler anymore (one of the very few things I thank God for being an Atheist), But I would like to correct your last statement a bit... it should read "Last I checked we never gassed people in that quantities".... Gaschamber is still legal mean of capital punishment in the US (at least in some of the states).
BEE_Grim_Reaper
Member
+15|6757|Germany

Spark wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

I thought the Brits did dresden am I not correct ?
More info at (where else) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of … ld_War_II.

Both did. And did it good, too.

One of many major bombing campaigns on German cities.
Yeah, they did... unfortunately, Dresden was a city without military value... it has been beautiful before though... one of the few baroque cities.... built even before the Brits actually thought of colonizing America.... well... there goes history and culture... in a hail of bombs
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6887

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

As for only East Germany haveing a Wall ...Are you really saying the USSR had open borders and allowed free travel ?  Everyone I know from the USSR had to Excape? Including sevaral Soldiers who excaped while patroling the borders to prevent excapes.
No, I am not...
Still, the only physical wall was in Germany, not USSR

By the way, Horseman, you might want to read this: http://forums.bf2s.com/help.php#bbcode
There it tells you, how to quote
Symantics You couldnt leave without risking your life.

The Irony about your tiff with renagade is that if The USA and GB had let the USSR have its way all Europe would have been eradicated Especially Germany, and with a vengence. Man if you think they had a rape fest after WWII than domt even think about what would have happend if The real Allies hadn't been there to face them down. You do recall theie attempt to starve Berlin or did they think everyone needed a little dieting ?

I could have sworn I read some where you posted something like

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

" all Europe might get together against the USA and You know what would happen ! "
but I cant find it. Did you post something like that and what did it mean ? what would happen. ?
Nehil
Member
+3|6781|South Sweden (NOT SWITZERLAND)

yuck7777 wrote:

How France does the unthinkable? The war in Iraq has yelded infomation that France since the end of the first gulf war was supplying Saddam with over $20 billion worth of military equipment and spare parts which were smuggled in through Siria. In exchange France got 23% of the Iraqis oil. All this while Iraq was under sanctions from the UN. And of couse they didn't back the Iraq war, Because it would make them lose the sweet deal they had.
Now with Iran. The French have been investing alot of money in Iran. The Big automotive companies have invested a big chunk of money there.
How can we trust France in there talks with Iran over the nukes? Should we boycott France? Should the US and there true Allies label France as a terrorist supporter or even a Terriorist state?
What do you think?
HAHAHAHAH, are you for real? Seriously, are you? This post was so dumb it even made my lazy ass post here, I hope you realize how much I am laughing right now?
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6887

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Spark wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

I thought the Brits did dresden am I not correct ?
More info at (where else) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of … ld_War_II.

Both did. And did it good, too.

One of many major bombing campaigns on German cities.
Yeah, they did... unfortunately, Dresden was a city without military value...

Excuse me ? did Germans live there?

it has been beautiful before though... one of the few baroque cities.... built even before the Brits actually thought of colonizing America.... well... there goes history and culture... in a hail of bombs
Well don't start an other world war then. besides your 0 and 2 time to find another National pastime, No ?

" We barbeque and gas millions of people but pout when you topple an old building in retaleation."

The real Irony here is that Germany tried to do the same thing to London, they just couldn't get the job done.
They would have done it cheerfully to as many "old pretty cities " as it took to win the war.

This is quickly becoming Sureal.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6725|Canberra, AUS

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Spark wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

I thought the Brits did dresden am I not correct ?
More info at (where else) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of … ld_War_II.

Both did. And did it good, too.

One of many major bombing campaigns on German cities.
Yeah, they did... unfortunately, Dresden was a city without military value... it has been beautiful before though... one of the few baroque cities.... built even before the Brits actually thought of colonizing America.... well... there goes history and culture... in a hail of bombs
Actually, Dresden, I believe, had a major railway station. Do I need to explain why this was important.

Anyhoo, the thing that made this attack even worse was that they didn't do squat the station (mabye a minor exaggeration, but you get what I mean). The trains were up and running the next day (the 16th), while Dresden burned.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6725|Canberra, AUS

Nehil wrote:

yuck7777 wrote:

How France does the unthinkable? The war in Iraq has yelded infomation that France since the end of the first gulf war was supplying Saddam with over $20 billion worth of military equipment and spare parts which were smuggled in through Siria. In exchange France got 23% of the Iraqis oil. All this while Iraq was under sanctions from the UN. And of couse they didn't back the Iraq war, Because it would make them lose the sweet deal they had.
Now with Iran. The French have been investing alot of money in Iran. The Big automotive companies have invested a big chunk of money there.
How can we trust France in there talks with Iran over the nukes? Should we boycott France? Should the US and there true Allies label France as a terrorist supporter or even a Terriorist state?
What do you think?
HAHAHAHAH, are you for real? Seriously, are you? This post was so dumb it even made my lazy ass post here, I hope you realize how much I am laughing right now?
Could you please read the last few posts. It has been said numerous times now that that paticular topic was ended some time ago.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
piett55
Member
+0|6714

Spark wrote:

I only wish that isn't true (first fact). The problem is the MEDIA. People are so brainwashed (in America) nowadays that (because every TV station is neocon-controlled, as far as I know) they believe what ever is spewed out at them.

Once people start to speak up...
lol, stop generalizing about something you don't know. I live here, and I can tell you, 90% of things I hear on T.V. are about how bad our country is, which it isn't. And I know how much the "Neo-Cons" as you call them, Conservative to people who can say big words, love America, so only 9% of MEDIA is controlled by Conservatives.

Last edited by piett55 (2006-01-29 01:42:14)

atlvolunteer
PKMMMMMMMMMM
+27|6821|Atlanta, GA USA

piett55 wrote:

Spark wrote:

I only wish that isn't true (first fact). The problem is the MEDIA. People are so brainwashed (in America) nowadays that (because every TV station is neocon-controlled, as far as I know) they believe what ever is spewed out at them.

Once people start to speak up...
lol, stop generalizing about something you don't know. I live here, and I can tell you, 90% of things I hear on T.V. are about how bad our country is, which it isn't. And I know how much the "Neo-Cons" as you call them, Conservative to people who can say big words, love America, so only 9% of MEDIA is controlled by Conservatives.
The majority of the (mainstream) media in the US is slightly liberal leaning (or more).  About the only mainstream media outlet that is conservative leaning is Fox News.
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6725|Canberra, AUS

atlvolunteer wrote:

piett55 wrote:

Spark wrote:

I only wish that isn't true (first fact). The problem is the MEDIA. People are so brainwashed (in America) nowadays that (because every TV station is neocon-controlled, as far as I know) they believe what ever is spewed out at them.

Once people start to speak up...
lol, stop generalizing about something you don't know. I live here, and I can tell you, 90% of things I hear on T.V. are about how bad our country is, which it isn't. And I know how much the "Neo-Cons" as you call them, Conservative to people who can say big words, love America, so only 9% of MEDIA is controlled by Conservatives.
The majority of the (mainstream) media in the US is slightly liberal leaning (or more).  About the only mainstream media outlet that is conservative leaning is Fox News.
Then why were you 25 times more likely to see a pro-war person than a anti-war person? Why were there very few detailed interviews with people opposing the Iraq War?
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
atlvolunteer
PKMMMMMMMMMM
+27|6821|Atlanta, GA USA

Spark wrote:

Then why were you 25 times more likely to see a pro-war person than a anti-war person? Why were there very few detailed interviews with people opposing the Iraq War?
I'm not sure where you're getting that.  I would say about 90% of the war coverage is negative.
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6887

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes...

( This is pretty silly to comment on, all it means is "thats the best they could do"
They would have dropped 687,897,000.76 million tons if they'd had the ability )

The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone....

( There was something of a WAR on, )

and not all of them exploded.... ( Hey We tried at least.)

when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.     

( Carefull with that shovel ! )

Well you should  Be Nice from now on. last I checked we never gassed anyone.
You're right... Germany could not do better... as matter of fact, the reason is because the Luftwaffe was completely designed for ground support and air superiority but was without a strategic ar.

As for "There was something of a WAR on".... There is definitely a difference between bombing strategic targets and bombing civilian non-com targets into rubble. On the other hand, the phrase "collateral damage" (aka civilian casualties) was not yet in use.

As a matter of fact, we are nice now since we do not have a Hitler anymore (one of the very few things I thank God for being an Atheist), But I would like to correct your last statement a bit... it should read "Last I checked we never gassed people in that quantities".... Gaschamber is still legal mean of capital punishment in the US (at least in some of the states).
Gaschamber is still legal mean of capital punishment in the US...

So do you think you will be visiting soon. We have a really cool looking Aquarium we want to show you.

You sit inside it!
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6887

Spark wrote:

atlvolunteer wrote:

piett55 wrote:


lol, stop generalizing about something you don't know. I live here, and I can tell you, 90% of things I hear on T.V. are about how bad our country is, which it isn't. And I know how much the "Neo-Cons" as you call them, Conservative to people who can say big words, love America, so only 9% of MEDIA is controlled by Conservatives.
The majority of the (mainstream) media in the US is slightly liberal leaning (or more).  About the only mainstream media outlet that is conservative leaning is Fox News.
Then why were you 25 times more likely to see a pro-war person than a anti-war person? Why were there very few detailed interviews with people opposing the Iraq War?
Really,  total bs, its all " We lost " cant win "  Etc..
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6891|Cologne, Germany

Horseman 77 wrote:

BEE_Grim_Reaper wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

And one has to note, that the highest bombload/year that Germany managed to drop was app. 400.000 tonnes...

( This is pretty silly to comment on, all it means is "thats the best they could do"
They would have dropped 687,897,000.76 million tons if they'd had the ability )

The allies dropped over 5.000.000 tonnes of ordinance in 1944 alone....

( There was something of a WAR on, )

and not all of them exploded.... ( Hey We tried at least.)

when you go to a big city and there is a new construction site, chances are good, that some WW II bomb is found during the excavation works.     

( Carefull with that shovel ! )

Well you should  Be Nice from now on. last I checked we never gassed anyone.
You're right... Germany could not do better... as matter of fact, the reason is because the Luftwaffe was completely designed for ground support and air superiority but was without a strategic ar.

As for "There was something of a WAR on".... There is definitely a difference between bombing strategic targets and bombing civilian non-com targets into rubble. On the other hand, the phrase "collateral damage" (aka civilian casualties) was not yet in use.

As a matter of fact, we are nice now since we do not have a Hitler anymore (one of the very few things I thank God for being an Atheist), But I would like to correct your last statement a bit... it should read "Last I checked we never gassed people in that quantities".... Gaschamber is still legal mean of capital punishment in the US (at least in some of the states).
Gaschamber is still legal mean of capital punishment in the US...

So do you think you will be visiting soon. We have a really cool looking Aquarium we want to show you.

You sit inside it!
lol ? you lost me there...

can we please stop taking WWII as a basis for comparing the US and Germany today ? Those were different times and very different countries. All of us were born way after WWII. Horseman can not take credit for what US soldiers two generations ago did and Reaper didn't fight for Hitler and shouldn't be blamed for gassing jews or invading poland.

that discussion is pointless.
atlvolunteer
PKMMMMMMMMMM
+27|6821|Atlanta, GA USA

B.Schuss wrote:

can we please stop taking WWII as a basis for comparing the US and Germany today ? Those were different times and very different countries. All of us were born way after WWII. Horseman can not take credit for what US soldiers two generations ago did and Reaper didn't fight for Hitler and shouldn't be blamed for gassing jews or invading poland.

that discussion is pointless.
I agree with you Schuss (doesn't that mean shoot?), just like people should quit bringing up slavery and what happened to the indians when they talk about America.  Its all ancient history.

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2024 Jeff Minard