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2006-01-17 20:37:25
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901

Spark wrote:

If you hate France, you are welcome to that. Just blow up the Statue of Liberty first (which was designed, built, and give to the US as a present by the French).
Cool with me i think it sucks,  I dont want your " poor, wretched, huddled, masses anyway " i wish they'd smack it

PS Our gift to France Was their Entire country, We want that back phllrrrrrt !
2006-01-17 20:43:38
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6739|Canberra, AUS

Horseman 77 wrote:

I dont want your " poor, wretched, huddled, masses anyway " i wish they'd smack it

PS Our gift to France Was their Entire country, We want that back phllrrrrrt !
Sorry, but I didn't get a word of that. What do you mean by the PS?
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
2006-01-17 21:07:38
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901

Marconius wrote:

Erkut.hv wrote:

Marconius wrote:

Bush just dicked around in Texas getting drunk and snorting crack, and there is no denying that.
1. Crack was not around in the Vietnam era.
2. You don't snort crack.

Get your facts straight sir.... =P
Awww...I made a boo-boo with my drug references.  Right...

Cocaine most certainly was a drug in 1972...as that's when GWB got arrested for possessing it in Harris County.  Crack, cocaine, smack, whateverthefuck, he did it.
Rather than being incarcerated, he was able to get away with a year of charity work.  Before 1972, he was a drunk.  After the year of charity work, he went straight back to his post-1972 ways.

http://www.realchange.org/bushjr.htm#cocaine
kid your a moron Grow up.
2006-01-17 21:14:58
Marconius
One-eyed Wonder Mod
+368|6758|San Francisco

Horseman 77 wrote:

Marconius wrote:

Erkut.hv wrote:


1. Crack was not around in the Vietnam era.
2. You don't snort crack.

Get your facts straight sir.... =P
Awww...I made a boo-boo with my drug references.  Right...

Cocaine most certainly was a drug in 1972...as that's when GWB got arrested for possessing it in Harris County.  Crack, cocaine, smack, whateverthefuck, he did it.
Rather than being incarcerated, he was able to get away with a year of charity work.  Before 1972, he was a drunk.  After the year of charity work, he went straight back to his post-1972 ways.

http://www.realchange.org/bushjr.htm#cocaine
kid your a moron Grow up.
Thank you most kindly, sir.  May I have another?  Or will you offer more of a rebuttal with facts to back it up next time?
2006-01-17 21:22:42
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901

Spark wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

I dont want your " poor, wretched, huddled, masses anyway " i wish they'd smack it

PS Our gift to France Was their Entire country, We want that back phllrrrrrt !
Sorry, but I didn't get a word of that. What do you mean by the PS?
My bad.....    its late for me I'm tired Sorry.

ok here we go  nice and  slow.
1   " give us  your  poor, wretched, huddled, masses "

       That what it says ( and I'm paraphrasing ) on the statue of Liberty.

  2    I wish they'd Smack it.

        Guess this one by yourself. Hint,   
        Has any structure been "Smacked"  By anything lately in NYC.

3      And Traditionally after a WAR that you Win You occupied that Country IE Germany     
        Beat France. Germany Kept France.

        The Allied forces Beat Germany (* The U.S.A. contributing the lions share)  Then we

               G A V E    I T     B A C K     to the French people. a gift !
               
              We helped out in WWI also. German Troops could see the Ifle Tower. sp.
              I think the US dough boy made a viable contribution.
              So I believe your Square on the Big Green statue Deal.

                    ok ?

             *" The free French help out. Made some tasty sandwiches and what not. "
2006-01-17 21:25:41
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6739|Canberra, AUS

Horseman 77 wrote:

Spark wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

I dont want your " poor, wretched, huddled, masses anyway " i wish they'd smack it

PS Our gift to France Was their Entire country, We want that back phllrrrrrt !
Sorry, but I didn't get a word of that. What do you mean by the PS?
My bad.....    its late for me I'm tired Sorry.

ok here we go  nice and  slow.
1   " give us  your  poor, wretched, huddled, masses "

       That what it says ( and I'm paraphrasing ) on the statue of Liberty.

  2    I wish they'd Smack it.

        Guess this one by yourself. Hint,   
        Has any structure been "Smacked"  By anything lately in NYC.

3      And Traditionally after a WAR that you Win You occupied that Country IE Germany     
        Beat France. Germany Kept France.

        The Allied forces Beat Germany (* The U.S.A. contributing the lions share)  Then we

               G A V E    I T     B A C K     to the French people. a gift !
               
              We helped out in WWI also. German Troops could see the Ifle Tower. sp.
              I think the US dough boy made a viable contribution.
              So I believe your Square on the Big Green statue Deal.

                    ok ?

             *" The free French help out. Made some tasty sandwiches and what not. "
thanks
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
2006-01-17 21:29:33
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901
anytime, "we are here to help,  we are people helpers" GW in NOLA
2006-01-17 21:42:34
TehSeraphim
Thread Ender
+58|6788|New Hampshire
French is just being Capitalistic - making money off any situation.  The US looks the other way for arms smugglers in order to get rid of some of its weapons it doesnt need.  When a large armed force leaves a country, its cheaper for them to dump their rifles than it is to have them shipped back home.  These are supposed to be destroyed, but can be sold off or stolen - we don't really care.

Let's not rip on France - if it wasn't for them all Americans would be drinking tea and singing God Save the Queen - if it wasn't for the French there would be no United States, so quit ripping on the French.  Personally, I believe they love freedom much more than the US does, since they are more willing to stand up for what they believe in.  We're just pissed off because they don't want to join us - there was a famous American who once said "I do not believe in what you say, but I will fight to the death your right to say it" - we as Americans often forget about this, and we shouldn't. 

As for situations such as WWII, if we'd acted in the beginning France would never had fallen to Germany.  For a couple of years we sold weapons to the Nazi war machine, as well as to the UK, while claiming neutrality.  We also did this in WWI.  Furthermor, instead of holding Germany to it's treaties, we appeased Hitler for numerous years, letting him have the Rhineland thinking he would go no further.  France was divided in WWII, with a large part of the country still owing alliegiance to the Allied forces, so we did not "give them back" their country - we helped them take it back.  The French did not "give us bacK" the United States in the Revolutionary War, they helped us take it back.

Don't knock on France just for doing what they like - the United States has a convenient habit of saying one thing and doing another.
2006-01-17 22:23:57
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901
bunnys suk france is cool
2006-01-17 22:32:50
tnt_dynamite
Member
+3|6805
Hey if it wasn't for "fucking France" we wouldn't be here. They basically were the turning point in both the revolutionary and civil wars. History doesn't lie, and France isn't an enemy of the US.
2006-01-17 22:40:52
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901

tnt_dynamite wrote:

Hey if it wasn't for "fucking France" we wouldn't be here. They basically were the turning point in both the revolutionary and civil wars. History doesn't lie, and France isn't an enemy of the US.
I never heard about France in the the Civil War? As for the Revolution, in the Toe to Toe, European type Set battles Yes they helped. But It was an Economic disaster For GB to fight even a guerilla War in the Colonies.
We would have drove them out that way also. With Probebly less blood shed.

I am just guessing tho .

Where can i find a good read about France's role in the Civil war here?

Why do people single out france for these attacks i assume most are tonge in cheek no ?
2006-01-17 23:00:40
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6739|Canberra, AUS
Interesting fact: Bush's cook is French.

Although I see why the US is a little bitter about the French. Although there was a Resistance in France during WWII, most of France was collaborating with the Nazis. Many Allied troops and spies were shot because they were betrayed by the French and handed to the Nazis. Not something that you would forgive lightly.

Where can i find a good read about France's role in the Civil war here?
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
2006-01-17 23:04:55
d3v1ldr1v3r13
Satan's disciple on Earth.
+160|6750|Hell's prison
Im not defending the USA, I mean we have done some morally illegal shit I am sure of.  I mean its no secret that we have spies in other countries, and I am sure we arent the only ones.  The Geneva conventions are there, but I am sure there are just some things they dont know about.  When France failed to back us on the war on terror, Automatically Americans shot at them, candyass, sissies, pussies, unnappreciative, you know.  But the honest to God truth is, we asked them to back us, they said they didnt want to be involved, the government said ok, and Americans complained and shunned them.  As for their trading with Iraq and Iran, and getting money, well yeah they are giving goods, and maybe military weapons, but they are not giving them these things with the intent that they fall into terrorist hands.  They are trading to benefit their country.  If they fall into terrorists hands, they were probably stolen from the country.  I dont honestly believe that France is supplying terrorists.  And if they are, I think they would be caught by now.  Regardless, France is doing what it needs to do for its country, and its people.  More power to them, what they do as far as the war on terror is fine, but i imagine that once Al Qaeda or another similar terrorist group strikes in France that kill a few hundred or even thousand, they will be the ones crying for blood like we did in 2001.  Of course looking back when we cried for blood, we are now bitching about a retreat from everything that the US and its allies have worked for in the past 5 years.
2006-01-17 23:41:16
vedds
Member
+52|6819|Christchurch New Zealand
I have made mention of this before in another thread, but i think the French govt has a somewhayt softer line on terrorists and terrorist attacks than some of us are comfortable with simply because they see it as a viable tactic.

The French Government sent at least 2 agents on a mission to carry out a terrorist act in another western nation. A nation with very close historical ties.

Two French Govt sposored terrorists detonated a bomb on board a ship at harbour in Auckland New Zealand.
Fortunatly only one person was killed in the explosion and subsequent sinking of the Rainbow Warrior.

The French government denied they were responsible until New Zealand Police arrested two agents. This was followed by a guilty plea toi the charges or Murder and Arson 10 year sentences were imposed. Subsequent terrorists escaped by yacht which was then allegedly scuttled and the terrorists picked up by Nuclear Submarine.
France was to pay compensation (something in the order of $10-15M NZD) and Apologise. The other half of the deal was that the Terrorists would be handed to the french who  were to imprison them in a french military jail.


The terrorists were handed over to french authorities who released them after only 2 years had elapsed.

The Murderers were given Medals shorlty after.
Nice work from somebodys "Close Friends"
It is my understanding that many French were disgusted by the actions of their Govt moreso because of the contribution to the liberations in both world wars. There  are many "Roue Anzac" or "Kiwi" etc in france im told.

So do theyt suppot Terrorists? Damn Straight. - THey ARE terrorists
Are they concerned or think they are doing anything wrong? Not at all.

So In short you can justify their soft on terror stance all you like and in any manner ( everybody else does it blah blah blah- it doesnt change the fact that they care only about france.

The US has been the Major stabilising force in the world for the last 60 years - France has been tipping it towards disorder.

Would you expect Abu Musaib Al-Zaquari to condemn other terrorists?
Then dont expect the French to.

(sits back and waits for the whiney assed liberals to flame me and try to justify France and Al-Zaquari in one fell swoop)
2006-01-17 23:47:56
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6739|Canberra, AUS
And yet the French President was the first to send condolences to the US after the 9/11 attacks.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
2006-01-18 00:05:06
vedds
Member
+52|6819|Christchurch New Zealand

Spark wrote:

And yet the French President was the first to send condolences to the US after the 9/11 attacks.
Condolences? yes! Empty Words? Definatly

Just looking out for their own interests........
2006-01-18 00:09:53
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6739|Canberra, AUS
How is that 'their own interests'? What do they gain?
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
2006-01-18 00:30:07
TehSeraphim
Thread Ender
+58|6788|New Hampshire
Horseman - FYI - during the Revolutionary War, there was no way in hell the US would have won without the French help.  The US didn't fight "Guerilla warfare" - for the most part they stuck to European style battles.  The French were the ones who supplied the Americans with rifles and gunpowder - where else were they gonna get these, Britain? lol

As for the French government - I'm sure they have spies.  Everyone does.  Furthermore, the French should be more afraid of Terrorists than the US - a majority of the terrorist acts of the past 50 years have been in Europe.  Their government, however, changes more often than some people change their underwear.  Seriously.  It's how the French work - so you cant blame one incident (which I'd like a link to - I find the facts somewhat questionable) on the government at the time.  Hell, how about the Contras incident?  Or Noriega?  Training Osama Bin Laden?  Oops.
2006-01-18 00:40:05
BEE_Grim_Reaper
Member
+15|6771|Germany
I am definitely more and more astonished how little some people, especially the younger ones know about history be general history or the history of their own country. Sometimes I presume it would be better to sit down and read a book about that topic (I am talking about scientific history books, they are not too hard to read) instead of blasting each other away in some kind of virtual war on computers via the internet.

I figure, this might be true:

"The most dangerous men in the world are not those who propagate dangerous ideologies... the most dangerous men are those who are so dumb and uneducated to follow those demagogues blindly and carry their ideology" (quote by myself).

Just think about it: what would Hitler have been if nobody would have followed him?
2006-01-18 00:50:09
vedds
Member
+52|6819|Christchurch New Zealand

TehSeraphim wrote:

so you cant blame one incident (which I'd like a link to - I find the facts somewhat questionable) on the government at the time.
1st up what do you find questionable?


Links:
wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of … ow_Warrior


search "rainbow warrior sinking" in google and you get this link up first.

www.geocities.com/shipwrecks_magazine/rainbow.htm

EDIT: NZ Police Website detailing the operation http://www.police.govt.nz/operation/wharf/


TehSeraphim wrote:

Hell, how about the Contras incident?  Or Noriega?  Training Osama Bin Laden?  Oops.
Doesnt justify the french supporting/being terrorists

Last edited by vedds (2006-01-18 00:53:24)

2006-01-18 01:19:22
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6905|Cologne, Germany

problem is, these days most news agencys in the US ( or the world, if you will ) have their own agenda and follow some kind of lobbying. They chose what view of a certain event they want to convey, by editing, by using certain words in the commentary, etc..

This is especially true for news reports from the middle east, as shown by the false translation of the news conference by the Iranian President.

Bottom line is, if you haven't witnessed a certain event yourself, there is a good chance you are only watching/hearing what the news agencies and their lobbyists want you to see. Best chance you have is probably to gather as much information from as many different sources as possible and then make your own judgement. but that requires an amount of initiative which a lot people seem to lack these days.

France sold weapons to Iraq ? Guess what, some of the weapons the Iranians have were delivered by the USA. No nation has a clean sheet on the weapons deals issue.
2006-01-18 07:11:49
sheggalism
Member
+16|6806|France
It's good to see that there are people who don't hate my country. I agree, our current president is a jerk, we call him "the mexican beer boozer and calf's head eater" All our politicians suck anyway.
2006-01-18 07:20:05
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6780

B.Schuss wrote:

problem is, these days most news agencys in the US ( or the world, if you will ) have their own agenda and follow some kind of lobbying. They chose what view of a certain event they want to convey, by editing, by using certain words in the commentary, etc..

This is especially true for news reports from the middle east, as shown by the false translation of the news conference by the Iranian President.

Bottom line is, if you haven't witnessed a certain event yourself, there is a good chance you are only watching/hearing what the news agencies and their lobbyists want you to see. Best chance you have is probably to gather as much information from as many different sources as possible and then make your own judgement. but that requires an amount of initiative which a lot people seem to lack these days.

France sold weapons to Iraq ? Guess what, some of the weapons the Iranians have were delivered by the USA. No nation has a clean sheet on the weapons deals issue.
yes i do agree w/ u, news agency's are showing things on what the journolist think that happened, u dont get the real perspective
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
2006-01-18 09:52:45
(HUN)Rudebwoy
Member
+45|6819

cyborg_ninja-117 wrote:

B.Schuss wrote:

France sold weapons to Iraq ? Guess what, some of the weapons the Iranians have were delivered by the USA. No nation has a clean sheet on the weapons deals issue.
yes i do agree w/ u, news agency's are showing things on what the journolist think that happened, u dont get the real perspective
Has anyone seen "Wag the dog"?
I agree w/u.

Last edited by (HUN)Rudebwoy (2006-01-18 17:20:15)

2006-01-18 14:56:05
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6901
Our current President stands head and shoulders over most world current leaders,
He leads and is not afraid to. He doesn't fear our enemies he make them fear us.
There are more Qualified and Smarter men in the USA but he has the job.

    Our last President couldn't even masturbate to completion or with out being caught.
The sad part is, That it was his sole response to the First WTC attack.
Had he actually chose to lead his country instead of playing with his little jimmy there is a good chance we wouldn't be in this mess.
Many people across the world had to die through his neglect and failure, unwillingness or in ability to act.

     At least this man did something and they haven't been back.

     As for France Supplying necessary Arms and ammunition to the Colonies in the Revolution. Almost every Colonist was Armed at the outset and was familiar with his weapon and its employment. Their Arms Primarily Kentucky and Pennsylvania Rifles were far superior to any standing Armies weapon at the time in Range and Accuracy.
Tho somewhat slower to load than a Brown Bess musket. It leant itself well to ambush sniping and "Tip and Run" tactics used in the Frontier areas where most of the Battles were fought. We never met the enemy on his terms.

 

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