like we know what they had in there. come on ATG. jesus christ.ATG wrote:
I find it disturbing that in the argument about what happened, few discuss what was in the building.
The Department of Defense (DOD), The Secret Service and Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) shared the 25th floor with the IRS in WTC 7.
DOD archives would have to included records of secret weapons programs, black ops. space war programs.
CIA archives would have included documentation of the JFK assassination, our various foreign covert adventures as well as a whole smorgasbord of national secrets.
All gone forever.
We never will now.usmarine2 wrote:
like we know what they had in there. come on ATG. jesus christ.ATG wrote:
I find it disturbing that in the argument about what happened, few discuss what was in the building.
The Department of Defense (DOD), The Secret Service and Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) shared the 25th floor with the IRS in WTC 7.
DOD archives would have to included records of secret weapons programs, black ops. space war programs.
CIA archives would have included documentation of the JFK assassination, our various foreign covert adventures as well as a whole smorgasbord of national secrets.
All gone forever.
Shiva.
and you would never know. so what the fuck are you on about then?
I want to know who is behind what is going on.usmarine2 wrote:
and you would never know. so what the fuck are you on about then?
If 9-11 was not a inside job, and I ain't saying it was, it was exploited by a power mad government.
As we teeter on the brink of economic calamity ( and what citizen wants that? ) I seek to know wtf is going on.
And, there were no other controversial topics at the moment that interested me.
well I want to know what goes on in the locker room of the UCLA's womens volleyball team. but it aint gonna happen.
The UCLA's womens volleyball team is not currently occupying Iraq, Afghanistan or building missle defense systems on Russias borders. They are not consuming 53% of the gdp. they are not dropping smart bombs or allowing illegal aliens and drugs to come into my country.usmarine2 wrote:
well I want to know what goes on in the locker room of the UCLA's womens volleyball team. but it aint gonna happen.
Did you not say a vow to defend our people from all enemies foreign and domestic? Did that duty end when you were discharged soldier?
yes it did end. unless red dawn happens, I could give a fuck about the big picture. I just live my life.
At least you Sir have earned that right.usmarine2 wrote:
yes it did end. unless red dawn happens, I could give a fuck about the big picture. I just live my life.
"alleged squibs." That is easily explained as differences in air pressure as the building collapses. A few points.Bell wrote:
If that is true (and I have no reason to question you), where does all of this explosive force come from as the building goes down? Huge chunks of concrete is thrown hundreds of feet away. For a building that came down into it's own footprint, I dont get where this horizontal force comes from. Those aledged squibs as the tower went down are somewhat suspect.imortal wrote:
No, the big red fireball was merely a PORTION of the fuel being burned off. The remainder of the fuel stayed around and kept burning for about 10 minutes after the crash.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
The big red fireball when the planes hit - that's the jet fuel exploding and burning off.
The big clouds of thick black smoke - that's the slow burning, oxygen deprived, office equipment fires.
Martyn
1. when concrete crumbles, especially in high-order destruction, at least some of it powders.
2. as the building collapses, the pressure on the floor above causes the entire floor to fail, falling more or less as a solid mass.
3. in each floor, as the ceiling approaches the floor, it compresses the air in the space. Remember, there is more room above those accoustic tiling; each floor has about 12 to 14 feet of relatively empty space, not the 8 to 10 feet we normally see and associate with a "floor."
4. As the air is compressed, the pressure rises. The windows, having never been designed to withstand that much of a pressure change, either shatter, or, far more likely, are ejected whole from their frames, only being held in place only by small metal clamps and caulked for waterproofing.
5. when the windows are ejected, the air now has somewhere to escape to, and the air pressure attempts to equalize by forcing air out of the window frames.
6. as the air is forced out, it picks up papers, concrete dust and powder, and any other light object, and forces them out with the air.
Now, here is the kicker. You see the exact same event in a controlled demolition. A compression wave of air forced out of window spaces, kicking out smoke and dust. In a controlled demolition, however, the compression wave is formed by an explosive. In the WTC, the collapsing floors provided the same type of pressure wave. They look do similar because they are in fact, nearly identical events, with the only change being the force provided.
The problem is, the fall characteristics of a WTC controlled detonation are not consistant with observable facts. IF those were demo charges, then the floor that detonated would begin to fall as soon as the charges go off, only to be caught up as the faster moving higher floors caught up and overtook it. That did not happen. pick a floor and watch it; it remains steady and stable until the falling wave of debris hits it; it is then forced to the speed of the debris wave.
Last edited by imortal (2008-07-19 16:37:46)
Sprinkler systems are not designed to put out large scale fires. They are gravity fed systems designed to put out or help contain relatively small fires. Also, the system operates from a single resivoir, so one or two burst pipes can drain the entire system, making the rest of it useless. That hollywood bit about all of the sprinklers activating at once is nonsense; each sprinkler head acts independantly.Bell wrote:
I am just trying to build a consistency. I can conceed that the planes hitting the towers brings in a whole load of variables that it be a dis service to gloss over Fine. But, if 7 wasnt hit by a plane, it only caught on fire, then why was that fire so intense that it brought the building down? Like I said the other buildings where engulfed in flames but stood up to it. 7 got off comparably lighter, yet it came down. Buildings have burned far longer than 7 with visually worse fires but stood up to it. From video, and pictures we can only see isolated fires on different levels.
Martyn
***EDIT: I find myself going back and finding even more faults. WTC 7 was not only damaged by fire, but its structural integrety was compromised by debris falling the WTC buildings.
Last edited by imortal (2008-07-19 21:05:17)
I find it interesting that people know what secret documents were in those offices.ATG wrote:
I find it disturbing that in the argument about what happened, few discuss what was in the building.
The Department of Defense (DOD), The Secret Service and Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) shared the 25th floor with the IRS in WTC 7.
DOD archives would have to included records of secret weapons programs, black ops. space war programs.
CIA archives would have included documentation of the JFK assassination, our various foreign covert adventures as well as a whole smorgasbord of national secrets.
All gone forever.
The DoD archives aren't in WTC 7. The most secret programs store records on site, not in some innocuous office space in NYC.
Why would you think CIA archives were in WTC 7? They've got a big facility in Langley VA that is MUCH more secure.
I'm hoping this is just my sarcasm detector malfunctioning...
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
That is actually an excellent point.imortal wrote:
The problem is, the fall characteristics of a WTC controlled detonation are not consistant with observable facts. IF those were demo charges, then the floor that detonated would begin to fall as soon as the charges go off, only to be caught up as the faster moving higher floors caught up and overtook it. That did not happen. pick a floor and watch it; it remains steady and stable until the falling wave of debris hits it; it is then forced to the speed of the debris wave.
I've always said it's obviously planes hit the building. I never said the destruction couldn't have been caused by the fires.
I totally believe Islamic nut jobs were likely responsible.
It's the explosion in spending and governmnet powers under George fuckwitmaximus Bush that worries me.
Halliburton. Blackwater.
The Iraq war is the most privately fought war in history.
oh ok ATG. I guess europe and japan were rebuilt by soldiers and farmers.
I find it highly more likely that all of those programs for the DOD would be contained somewhere more central and controllable... say the Pentagon?ATG wrote:
IDOD archives would have to included records of secret weapons programs, black ops. space war programs.
CIA archives would have included documentation of the JFK assassination, our various foreign covert adventures as well as a whole smorgasbord of national secrets.
All gone forever.
And the CIA information, if it even exists would most likely be safer in their dedicated building in Langley, VA, then it would be it what is, for all practical purposes, a normal office building.
And if they did want to destroy evidence, what would make this location so special, instead of any of their other satalite offices around the country?
Sure.
All a big multi-pronged coinkydink.
All a big multi-pronged coinkydink.
Watch this movie
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/
It has video of tower 7 going down. it shows tower 7 in parallel with a building being imploded and they look exactly the same.
There are also pictures of damaged columns from the twin towers that seem to show that they were wrapped with thermite cord and imploded.
Those planes should not have brought those towers down. and if the floors did collapse then why were the internal collumns not standing, at least some of them should have survived but none of them did.
I think that tower 7 was also supposed to be attacked and was set with demolitions to be imploded. But when the attack on tower 7 didn't happen, it could not be left standing because there would have been an inspection of the tower and that would have revealed that the building was set to be demolished prior to the attack. A weak attack, followed by planned implosion.
Also on the BBC film did it look like tower 7 was "fully involved" on fire on all floors twenty minutes after it was to have fallen down. Also on the Zeitgeist film tower 7 did not look to be in flames.
Anyway, if you haven't seen Zeitgeist yet, its worth watching and parts are pretty funny.
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/
It has video of tower 7 going down. it shows tower 7 in parallel with a building being imploded and they look exactly the same.
There are also pictures of damaged columns from the twin towers that seem to show that they were wrapped with thermite cord and imploded.
Those planes should not have brought those towers down. and if the floors did collapse then why were the internal collumns not standing, at least some of them should have survived but none of them did.
I think that tower 7 was also supposed to be attacked and was set with demolitions to be imploded. But when the attack on tower 7 didn't happen, it could not be left standing because there would have been an inspection of the tower and that would have revealed that the building was set to be demolished prior to the attack. A weak attack, followed by planned implosion.
Also on the BBC film did it look like tower 7 was "fully involved" on fire on all floors twenty minutes after it was to have fallen down. Also on the Zeitgeist film tower 7 did not look to be in flames.
Anyway, if you haven't seen Zeitgeist yet, its worth watching and parts are pretty funny.
funny eh? go fuck yourself dickhead
I was referring to the cartoons portraying religion as a scam. Maybe you should watch the movie and not make assumptions about what I think is funny. F yourself dickheadusmarine2 wrote:
funny eh? go fuck yourself dickhead
I watched that stupid movie
It was a controlled demolition tbh
wholly fuckwits Batman we are out numbered, Retreat!!!!!!
face...fucking...palm
This is beyond ludicrous.
This is beyond ludicrous.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
not retreat. just attacking in a different direction.Lotta_Drool wrote:
wholly fuckwits Batman we are out numbered, Retreat!!!!!!
why do think all the other ones were closed? wake up mods.FEOS wrote:
face...fucking...palm
This is beyond ludicrous.
...and this is why I refer to it as a religion or cult; unshakable belief in the midst of contrary evidence.