Pages: 1 2

 

2008-06-02 12:21:11
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6997
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/ … 239225.htm

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/13/opini … ref=slogin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_oil_law_(2007)

Nothing to do with oil, riiiiiiiiiiiiigggggggghhhhhhhhttt.

It's very telling that this legislation was one of Al Maliki's 'benchmarks' for progress as decreed by the occupying Americans. Fucking imperialism.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-06-02 12:21:46)

2008-06-02 12:24:35
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

Of course it's a benchmark..lol
It's the only fucking way that country is going to make money and support itself again. I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.

I've got some disappointing news. Iraq needs to attract foreign investors.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 12:29:01
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6997

Kmarion wrote:

Of course it's a benchmark..lol
It's the only fucking way that country is going to make money and support itself again. I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.
Oh yes, of course, handing exploitation rights for 75% of Iraqi oil to foreigners is exactly what Iraq needs. Look how much it benefited all those Latin American countries over the past few decades... pffft.

I love the brazenness incidentally: the Bush administration hired the consulting firm BearingPoint to help write the law in 2004.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-06-02 12:30:23)

2008-06-02 12:32:29
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

CameronPoe wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Of course it's a benchmark..lol
It's the only fucking way that country is going to make money and support itself again. I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.
Oh yes, of course, handing exploitation rights for 75% of Iraqi oil to foreigners is exactly what Iraq needs. Look how much it benefited all those Latin American countries over the past few decades... pffft.
C'mon Cam everyone else is doing it. Exploitation is the name of the game in the ME. I don't think you fully understand what it means to "hand over rights". You do realize Iraqi's get paid revenues for allowing these things right? Yes they need the money.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 12:37:04
Mekstizzle
WALKER
+3,611|7063|London, England
Yeah, and then a few decades down the line some leader will be like "fuck this shyt", re-nationalise the oil industry. Then other people will be like "fuck", and invade the country, and re-privatise the place and it's an endless cycle until we no longer need that black shit
2008-06-02 12:38:00
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

If they were smart Mek they would write short term leases. Right now they cant get enough investors in though.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 12:38:07
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6997

Kmarion wrote:

C'mon Cam everyone else is doing it. Exploitation is the name of the game in the ME. I don't think you fully understand what it means to "hand over rights". You do realize Iraqi's get paid revenues for allowing these things right? Yes they need the money.
Nope. Fuck that. I won't endorse exploitation. Not by the Brits, not by the French, not by the Russians, not by the Chinese, not by the US. The US should not be helping to write IRAQI legislation for a start. I thought you were bringing them 'freedom and democracy', i.e; self determination. Benchmarks. This really scrapes the bottom of the barrel. No better than the USSR or Mao's China (which I'm just after reading a lengthy and rather shocking book about).

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-06-02 12:38:54)

2008-06-02 12:42:41
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

CameronPoe wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

C'mon Cam everyone else is doing it. Exploitation is the name of the game in the ME. I don't think you fully understand what it means to "hand over rights". You do realize Iraqi's get paid revenues for allowing these things right? Yes they need the money.
Nope. Fuck that. I won't endorse exploitation. Not by the Brits, not by the French, not by the Russians, not by the Chinese, not by the US. The US should not be helping to write IRAQI legislation for a start. I thought you were bringing them 'freedom and democracy', i.e;, self determination. Benchmarks. This really scrapes the bottom of the barrel. No better than the USSR or Mao's China.
I was being facetious. Just pointing out that nearly every oil producing nation in the region has opened their doors for exploitation.. selling out their own. Like I said before I think short term leases while they bring their own capacity up might be the best solution. They need foreign dollars to do this. There is no way around it short of continued American charity via the tax payer.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 12:58:09
too_money2007
Member
+145|6750|Keller, Tx
I say carpet bomb the entire ME and take the oil for ourselves.
2008-06-02 13:19:00
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7199|Argentina

Kmarion wrote:

Of course it's a benchmark..lol
It's the only fucking way that country is going to make money and support itself again. I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.

I've got some disappointing news. Iraq needs to attract foreign investors.
Yeah, people like to travel to warzones.
2008-06-02 13:27:48
FatherTed
xD
+3,936|6942|so randum
i can't wait for raamunition
Small hourglass island
Always raining and foggy
Use an umbrella
2008-06-02 13:28:13
CaptainSpaulding71
Member
+119|6799|CA, USA
i read somewhere that Iran outsources refining of 40% of its oil?  why is that?  In fact, i read that this is quite common in the ME in that they pay someone to drill the oil for them, refine it for them, sell it for them, and then they keep the profits.  work ethics are different i guess.
2008-06-02 13:40:09
Masques
Black Panzer Party
+184|7164|Eastern PA

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

i read somewhere that Iran outsources refining of 40% of its oil?  why is that?  In fact, i read that this is quite common in the ME in that they pay someone to drill the oil for them, refine it for them, sell it for them, and then they keep the profits.  work ethics are different i guess.
It's cheaper to pay an outside contractor that hires migrant labor from the Philippines, India, and Pakistan (where most foreign laborers in the ME originate) to do drilling, etc. while reserving management and skilled labor jobs for citizens. In fact, many oil producing countries don't have domestic refining capacity.
2008-06-02 13:40:51
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,072|7214|PNW

CameronPoe wrote:

Nope. Fuck that. I won't endorse exploitation.
Where do you get your oil?
2008-06-02 13:45:44
CaptainSpaulding71
Member
+119|6799|CA, USA

Masques wrote:

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

i read somewhere that Iran outsources refining of 40% of its oil?  why is that?  In fact, i read that this is quite common in the ME in that they pay someone to drill the oil for them, refine it for them, sell it for them, and then they keep the profits.  work ethics are different i guess.
It's cheaper to pay an outside contractor that hires migrant labor from the Philippines, India, and Pakistan (where most foreign laborers in the ME originate) to do drilling, etc. while reserving management and skilled labor jobs for citizens. In fact, many oil producing countries don't have domestic refining capacity.
Masques:  ok agreed.

Cam:  is your argument that the iraqis should be drilling and refining their own oil then?  The above argument by Masques seems very pertinent.
2008-06-02 14:09:45
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Of course it's a benchmark..lol
It's the only fucking way that country is going to make money and support itself again. I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.

I've got some disappointing news. Iraq needs to attract foreign investors.
Yeah, people like to travel to warzones.
Foreign investing doesn't mean traveling to a war zone. Investors will provide the necessary startup funding. Companies could employ the local populace if they were confident they wouldn't be blowing themselves up. Without a guarantee on their return there simply hasn't been enough motivation (yet).
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 14:14:21
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7199|Argentina

Kmarion wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Of course it's a benchmark..lol
It's the only fucking way that country is going to make money and support itself again. I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.

I've got some disappointing news. Iraq needs to attract foreign investors.
Yeah, people like to travel to warzones.
Foreign investing doesn't mean traveling to a war zone. Investors will provide the necessary startup funding. Companies could employ the local populace if they were confident they wouldn't be blowing themselves up. Without a guarantee on their return there simply hasn't been enough motivation (yet).
I was addressing the tourism boom part.
2008-06-02 14:39:14
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

sergeriver wrote:


Yeah, people like to travel to warzones.
Foreign investing doesn't mean traveling to a war zone. Investors will provide the necessary startup funding. Companies could employ the local populace if they were confident they wouldn't be blowing themselves up. Without a guarantee on their return there simply hasn't been enough motivation (yet).
I was addressing the tourism boom part.
I'm thinking their tourism wasn't so great prior to the war. At least in terms of generating revenue vs oil. Could be wrong though.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 14:51:00
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7199|Argentina

Kmarion wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Foreign investing doesn't mean traveling to a war zone. Investors will provide the necessary startup funding. Companies could employ the local populace if they were confident they wouldn't be blowing themselves up. Without a guarantee on their return there simply hasn't been enough motivation (yet).
I was addressing the tourism boom part.
I'm thinking their tourism wasn't so great prior to the war. At least in terms of generating revenue vs oil. Could be wrong though.
I guess you are right.  Nevertheless, tourism has decreased since then.  I sell travels for a living, and I don't see any tours including Baghdad.
2008-06-02 16:34:39
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6847|North Carolina

Mek-Stizzle wrote:

Yeah, and then a few decades down the line some leader will be like "fuck this shyt", re-nationalise the oil industry. Then other people will be like "fuck", and invade the country, and re-privatise the place and it's an endless cycle until we no longer need that black shit
I used to be in favor of nationalizing things like oil, but after looking at how inefficient national oil companies like Saudi Aramco are, I want Iraq's oil to be fully privatized -- preferably by foreign companies.
2008-06-02 16:51:11
NantanCochise
Member
+55|6421|Portugal/United States

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

i read somewhere that Iran outsources refining of 40% of its oil?  why is that?  In fact, i read that this is quite common in the ME in that they pay someone to drill the oil for them, refine it for them, sell it for them, and then they keep the profits.  work ethics are different i guess.
Absolutely right, I dont know what Cam's on about but it would be impossible for Iraq to exploit even a third of its oil. Foreign companies took care of that in Saddams Iraq like most of the middle east, 60 years ago and still today. Nothing has really changed. Once Iraq was occupied both Bush and Blair signed a declaration that foreign companies (specifically US and British) would not control Iraqi oil. This was done to limit international concerns that the war was purely fought for control over Iraqi oil. Now that Iraq has a so called government it can choose the do what it wants with its oil. For them to drill, refine, transport and than sell it can only be done by allowing foreign leases. Iraq does not have sufficient infrustructure to completely control its own oil, like it was even before the war and when Sadam was in power. Im just pointing out the obvious, in no way do I agree nor disagree with this, I really dont know enough about it. You guys are still going to choose an opinion, Riiigggggghhhhhhhhhhtttttt...
2008-06-02 17:29:18
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7043|132 and Bush

CaptainSpaulding71 wrote:

i read somewhere that Iran outsources refining of 40% of its oil?  why is that?  In fact, i read that this is quite common in the ME in that they pay someone to drill the oil for them, refine it for them, sell it for them, and then they keep the profits.  work ethics are different i guess.
Somewhere.

If you don't remember:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6243644.stm
They were rationing fuel last year.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-06-02 17:33:47
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6853|'Murka

CameronPoe wrote:

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/0D09B919-D28A-4CC4-A79F-0EE500239225.htm

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/13/opini … ref=slogin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_oil_law_(2007)

Nothing to do with oil, riiiiiiiiiiiiigggggggghhhhhhhhttt.

It's very telling that this legislation was one of Al Maliki's 'benchmarks' for progress as decreed by the occupying Americans. Fucking imperialism.
Some other perspectives on the law:
http://www.usip.org/pubs/usipeace_brief … arbon.html

http://www.slate.com/id/2161629/

http://www.iraqdevelopmentprogram.org/i … olilaw.htm

(Irish oil company benefits from Iraq Oil Law) DOH!
http://www.finfacts.com/irelandbusiness … 0885.shtml

http://www.forbes.com/2007/03/06/hydroc … xford.html
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-06-02 18:40:26
RoosterCantrell
Goodbye :)
+399|6922|Somewhere else

Kmarion wrote:

I hear tourism isn't exactly booming in Baghdad.
Bad choice of words tbh. (im just kidding ya)

This is pretty obvious and completely expected.  I agree with Cam, it's fucking wrong, but it's the way the world is now... plain and simple.  The Energy Wars have begun,  First phase is to secure as much as possible using methods that spark the least amount of global backlash.  The best vehicle being in the name of "FREEDOM"

Second Phase is open hostilities with even more transperant agendas... and The U.S. is getting there.  Helmed by an Oil Businessman,  America just stepped into the direction first that interested Bush the most.  We are still tagging on the WMD bullshit, this time it is Iran.  With the potential Energy Crisis looming pretty soon nations will be becoming more agressive.  The U.S. just happened to be the nation to first start laying claims.  Not that THAT is a good thing, but it happened.  False Entitlement from Power Arrogance.  China is trying the same to a degree by claiming natural Gas rights in certain offshore areas, for example.

The shit storm is just starting IMO.  Hopefully Diplomacy will reign in any chance of WW3.

Last edited by RoosterCantrell (2008-06-02 18:41:58)

2008-06-02 20:51:38
Pug
UR father's brother's nephew's former roommate
+652|6984|Texas - Bigger than France
In other news, I was talking to someone recently who said that a geo crew recently found (or possible restated reserves they've already found) to a massive amount of oil under Iraqi land.  Larger than that in Saudi Arabia.

I've been unable to find anything confirming it, but it was an oil man who told me.  Anyone hear of this?

 

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