Because that is all you see, so eventually it tends to piss people off yes? Keep in mind the UK has pretty much been everywhere we have for a long time now, yet I rarely see anything about that.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Maybe the reason is that when it is mentioned, we say "Yep, we screwed up too" and that's the end of it. But mention any time that the US screwed up and half the Americans on the forums get all "No! Not True! We never screw up! God Bless America!".usmarine2005 wrote:
Ya but it is never mentioned is it?Scorpion0x17 wrote:
We're not saying that none of that happened.
Look thru some older threads about Afghanistan, all you see from UK people is "we are cleaning up your mess." Well, it appears to be your mess also.
Why does the truth piss you off?usmarine2005 wrote:
Because that is all you see, so eventually it tends to piss people off yes? Keep in mind the UK has pretty much been everywhere we have for a long time now, yet I rarely see anything about that.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Maybe the reason is that when it is mentioned, we say "Yep, we screwed up too" and that's the end of it. But mention any time that the US screwed up and half the Americans on the forums get all "No! Not True! We never screw up! God Bless America!".usmarine2005 wrote:
Ya but it is never mentioned is it?
Look thru some older threads about Afghanistan, all you see from UK people is "we are cleaning up your mess." Well, it appears to be your mess also.
It doesn't. Half truth pisses me off.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Why does the truth piss you off?usmarine2005 wrote:
Because that is all you see, so eventually it tends to piss people off yes? Keep in mind the UK has pretty much been everywhere we have for a long time now, yet I rarely see anything about that.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Maybe the reason is that when it is mentioned, we say "Yep, we screwed up too" and that's the end of it. But mention any time that the US screwed up and half the Americans on the forums get all "No! Not True! We never screw up! God Bless America!".
If person A commits act 1, and person B commits act 2, then person C comes along and says "Person A did Act 1", the fact that they didn't mention either person B or act 2, doesn't make the statement a half truth.usmarine2005 wrote:
It doesn't. Half truth pisses me off.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Why does the truth piss you off?usmarine2005 wrote:
Because that is all you see, so eventually it tends to piss people off yes? Keep in mind the UK has pretty much been everywhere we have for a long time now, yet I rarely see anything about that.
Last edited by Scorpion0x17 (2007-08-01 16:39:19)
Ok......good point.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
If person A commits act 1, and person B commits act 2, then person C comes along and says "Person A did Act 1", the fact that they didn't mention either person B or act 2, doesn't make the statement a half truth.usmarine2005 wrote:
It doesn't. Half truth pisses me off.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Why does the truth piss you off?
How about not telling the full story then?
Why should it piss you off?usmarine2005 wrote:
Because that is all you see, so eventually it tends to piss people off yes? Keep in mind the UK has pretty much been everywhere we have for a long time now, yet I rarely see anything about that.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Maybe the reason is that when it is mentioned, we say "Yep, we screwed up too" and that's the end of it. But mention any time that the US screwed up and half the Americans on the forums get all "No! Not True! We never screw up! God Bless America!".usmarine2005 wrote:
Ya but it is never mentioned is it?
Look thru some older threads about Afghanistan, all you see from UK people is "we are cleaning up your mess." Well, it appears to be your mess also.
I'm not pissed off about people criticising the UK for doing stupid things (Suez, selling nukes to Israel, Iraq - the list could go on forever). It's not me they're criticising, it's the government - who are usually deserving of most of the criticism they get.
Why should people thinking that lots of these warmongering US politicians are complete muppets piss you off? Seems strange to me.
Last edited by Bertster7 (2007-08-01 16:40:49)
I don't get why we only see US threads about the taliban and al-Q.Bertster7 wrote:
Why should people thinking that lots of these warmongering US politicians are complete muppets piss you off? Seems strange to me.
It is the whole story - it is the story of Person A committing act 1.usmarine2005 wrote:
Ok......good point.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
If person A commits act 1, and person B commits act 2, then person C comes along and says "Person A did Act 1", the fact that they didn't mention either person B or act 2, doesn't make the statement a half truth.usmarine2005 wrote:
It doesn't. Half truth pisses me off.
How about not telling the full story then?
I guess person B should be ignored then......Scorpion0x17 wrote:
It is the whole story - it is the story of Person A committing act 1.usmarine2005 wrote:
Ok......good point.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
If person A commits act 1, and person B commits act 2, then person C comes along and says "Person A did Act 1", the fact that they didn't mention either person B or act 2, doesn't make the statement a half truth.
How about not telling the full story then?
We don't only see US threads about the taliban and al-Q - maybe that's all you see - but, maybe it's because they and US policy are the primary topic in the news.usmarine2005 wrote:
I don't get why we only see US threads about the taliban and al-Q.Bertster7 wrote:
Why should people thinking that lots of these warmongering US politicians are complete muppets piss you off? Seems strange to me.
If persons D or E want to discuss person B, that's fine.usmarine2005 wrote:
I guess person B should be ignored then......Scorpion0x17 wrote:
It is the whole story - it is the story of Person A committing act 1.usmarine2005 wrote:
Ok......good point.
How about not telling the full story then?
lord have mercy....D G X B....stop.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
If persons D or E want to discuss person B, that's fine.usmarine2005 wrote:
I guess person B should be ignored then......Scorpion0x17 wrote:
It is the whole story - it is the story of Person A committing act 1.
Can we get back to discussing how the US and everyone in it are Imperialist, two-faced, lying pig-dogs and are responsible for all the known evils in the known universe (not to mention the known unknowns (and the unknown unknowns)) then?usmarine2005 wrote:
lord have mercy....D G X B....stop.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
If persons D or E want to discuss person B, that's fine.usmarine2005 wrote:
I guess person B should be ignored then......
Well, there was more US involvement and it was higher profile.usmarine2005 wrote:
I don't get why we only see US threads about the taliban and al-Q.Bertster7 wrote:
Why should people thinking that lots of these warmongering US politicians are complete muppets piss you off? Seems strange to me.
If you want to start a thread about European involvement go for it. Alternatively, we could discuss it here. I'd be happy to.
Who are the "bad" guys?
are they the isreals who take al palastinian as a hostage. lock tehm in 2 caves and decided when they are able to get water, power and food
or is it the country which attack another wiht the wrong resons?
or the guys which blow up themself in an schoolbus?
the answer is noody of them are the real bad ones
the guys who have to shoot ,(doenst matter if they are in in army like the us soldiers) or insurgents - or guys they lowup their selfs, are just the politician tools
theres a big game out there. one side wanna have this - the reaction from other side follows and so on.... this real big game goes on since 1930 (in real much longer). in fact its just a question of interrest. at a time us was at cold war with udssr they gave waepons o their enemys thinking their enemys are my friends. nowit turns out it isnt so easy.
same idea other "friends" now...
at the tend we are all humans. with different ideologies but not as far different as we think. (i dont wanna explain this point to long)
every side has his own bad and good guys. all of us make mistakes doesnt matter with religion, which color or in which country youre born.
every man wanna have his woman (or more of them lol) wanna life protected or help to protect. we all try to have a good life.
the problem is the time and the history polarised the world in some big sides and many small groups of interrest and abilities.
so if we like to hear it or not. we have enemys (and often they got their weapons by our own country) but they arent the real bad guys.
i also didnt belive that there is a real bad president who jsut liek to make war and let people die do get oil and money... not ts much more complex and also he isnt the bad one...
also an bin laden (by the way i didnt agree with anything he do or said or belive) or someone of these guys jsut do what they think isright. do not forget many of these guys spent a big part of their lifes fighting against russion soldiers they killed tausands of people in their country.. and now they think the us is the same bad as russian was,...
so there is alsways a reason why some of this people seems to be the bad one
in fact its just the human nature. we always wanna have more than our neighbor. we like to fight. we like to bully,... its just human...
the hole written history of mankind we fight each other. and depending who has won there was always a good and bad side
do not missunderstand. i dont not say o not fight our enemys. we have to. all of us have to decide which side we wanna be (there is no neutral middle not really) and if we didnt beat our enemys they will beat us. but do not think they are the bad one. there isnt a bad side there is just the opposit side of interrest
if something is the right thing or someone is the bad guy jsut depend of the view. if a real neutral look all all this what we do i dont know what he really would said: all crazy? or they all have no choice ? i dont know
are they the isreals who take al palastinian as a hostage. lock tehm in 2 caves and decided when they are able to get water, power and food
or is it the country which attack another wiht the wrong resons?
or the guys which blow up themself in an schoolbus?
the answer is noody of them are the real bad ones
the guys who have to shoot ,(doenst matter if they are in in army like the us soldiers) or insurgents - or guys they lowup their selfs, are just the politician tools
theres a big game out there. one side wanna have this - the reaction from other side follows and so on.... this real big game goes on since 1930 (in real much longer). in fact its just a question of interrest. at a time us was at cold war with udssr they gave waepons o their enemys thinking their enemys are my friends. nowit turns out it isnt so easy.
same idea other "friends" now...
at the tend we are all humans. with different ideologies but not as far different as we think. (i dont wanna explain this point to long)
every side has his own bad and good guys. all of us make mistakes doesnt matter with religion, which color or in which country youre born.
every man wanna have his woman (or more of them lol) wanna life protected or help to protect. we all try to have a good life.
the problem is the time and the history polarised the world in some big sides and many small groups of interrest and abilities.
so if we like to hear it or not. we have enemys (and often they got their weapons by our own country) but they arent the real bad guys.
i also didnt belive that there is a real bad president who jsut liek to make war and let people die do get oil and money... not ts much more complex and also he isnt the bad one...
also an bin laden (by the way i didnt agree with anything he do or said or belive) or someone of these guys jsut do what they think isright. do not forget many of these guys spent a big part of their lifes fighting against russion soldiers they killed tausands of people in their country.. and now they think the us is the same bad as russian was,...
so there is alsways a reason why some of this people seems to be the bad one
in fact its just the human nature. we always wanna have more than our neighbor. we like to fight. we like to bully,... its just human...
the hole written history of mankind we fight each other. and depending who has won there was always a good and bad side
do not missunderstand. i dont not say o not fight our enemys. we have to. all of us have to decide which side we wanna be (there is no neutral middle not really) and if we didnt beat our enemys they will beat us. but do not think they are the bad one. there isnt a bad side there is just the opposit side of interrest
if something is the right thing or someone is the bad guy jsut depend of the view. if a real neutral look all all this what we do i dont know what he really would said: all crazy? or they all have no choice ? i dont know
You know GTT, the Russians were the "bad guys" at that time.
In 2004-2005? I don't get what you're after here. The OP was about us tossing weapons to arm security forces in Iraq and then their prompt disappearance without any paper trail. Turkey then reports that US weapons show up in the hands of Kurdish guerrilas in their mist...usmarine2005 wrote:
You know GTT, the Russians were the "bad guys" at that time.
So far as I know, my next door neighbors haven't been the bad guys for at least 20 years give or take. Nazdrovia!
good guys - bad guys, that's all just a matter of perspective, at least on a strategic level. In the 1980's the russians were the "bad" guys, and western intelligence services were all too happy to provide the "good" taliban with supplies and weapons. And now, the taliban are the "bad" guys, and why ?
well , guess what, it's because they are doing the exact same thing as back in the 1980's. Fighting against a foreign power and their local puppet regime which is trying to gain control over their territory. But now it's the US and their allies they are fighting against. I imagine russian veterans of the afghanistan war are laughing their asses off. Oh, the irony.....
And it's the same in the Iran - Iraq affair.
good - bad, allies - enemies...those terms seem to vary over the years, depending on the strategics necessities at the time.
so, did we arm the "bad" guys ?
sure thing...cause at some point, they were considered to be "good"...well, at least good enough to fight the "bad" guys for us...and so on and so forth...
well , guess what, it's because they are doing the exact same thing as back in the 1980's. Fighting against a foreign power and their local puppet regime which is trying to gain control over their territory. But now it's the US and their allies they are fighting against. I imagine russian veterans of the afghanistan war are laughing their asses off. Oh, the irony.....
And it's the same in the Iran - Iraq affair.
good - bad, allies - enemies...those terms seem to vary over the years, depending on the strategics necessities at the time.
so, did we arm the "bad" guys ?
sure thing...cause at some point, they were considered to be "good"...well, at least good enough to fight the "bad" guys for us...and so on and so forth...
Somewhere in the Middle East, Yuri Orlov is laughing....
Illegal arms trade FTW!
Illegal arms trade FTW!
Last edited by Turquoise (2007-08-02 20:47:15)
...where 190,000 kalishnikovs went? Last seen in transport aircraft headed to Iraq.
Air America II?
ummm...
*shrugs*
*shrugs*
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6932710.stmSchwarzelungen wrote:
ummm...
*shrugs*
a) funnelled to another country as part of a clandestine arms sale
b) stolen for sale on black market
c) stolen for global jihad
d) corrupt bureaucracy at work
b) stolen for sale on black market
c) stolen for global jihad
d) corrupt bureaucracy at work
They are combing all 190,000 of them to make a new type of WMD