Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5400|London, England

Doctor Strangelove wrote:

Spark wrote:

So it's over for now? What a pathetic fucking farce this has all been.
The fact of the matter is that everyone realizes that defaulting is the dumbest thing the US could ever do. The Republicans dragged it out some much to score some political points. I realized weeks ago that the ceiling would be raised, but only at  the last minute so that everyone could use it as a vehicle to make a big stink about whatever.
Duh. But it fed the 24 hour news cycle admirably didn't it?
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5400|London, England
It had drama, and villains and heroes.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6453|'Murka

Doctor Strangelove wrote:

Spark wrote:

So it's over for now? What a pathetic fucking farce this has all been.
The fact of the matter is that everyone realizes that defaulting is the dumbest thing the US could ever do. The RepublicansBoth parties dragged it out some much to score some political points. I realized weeks ago that the ceiling would be raised, but only at  the last minute so that everyone could use it as a vehicle to make a big stink about whatever.
fixt
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6148|eXtreme to the maX
The real problem has not been addressed by any stretch, debt and borrowing are still hopelessly unsustainable.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6759

FEOS wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

FEOS wrote:


You act as if a government that brings in $230B a month isn't making enough money...
Not when they've got the military-industrial complex to support, no.
The highest defense budget has been ~$700B. That's about 3 months' worth of income. And that includes foreign aid in there, as well.
US gov spends more on Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security AFAIK.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6148|eXtreme to the maX
And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6759

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
No one needs to spend shit when they can just call America when shit happens.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
RAIMIUS
You with the face!
+244|6757|US

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
Most countries also have terribly trained forces, or not enough logistics to keep fighting for more than a couple weeks....

Reference the UK and their "seasonal" carrier planning, Tomahawk shortage in Libya, and lack of trained Eurofighter strike pilots. 
...and the UK has one of the more respected militaries in the world!
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6643|132 and Bush

Breaking News: Moody's says U.S. will keep AAA credit rating after President Obama signed a bill to raise the federal debt ceiling. - http://bit.ly/9Ft6Ko

Hehe
Xbone Stormsurgezz
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6453|'Murka

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
And most countries don't have the international security obligations of the US. So not so bizarre, if you look more than a millimeter deep.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6759

FEOS wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
And most countries don't have the international security obligations of the US. So not so bizarre, if you look more than a millimeter deep.
4% GDP military spending isn't that high... Besides most of it is pay to servicemen and veteran benefits.

Singapore is spending roughly the same on GDP and no one seems to be bitching.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5628

Well, we did get downgraded Kmar. Just not by Moody's.
Chinese agency downgrades U.S. credit rating
That doesn't doesn't seem political at all. /sarcasm

Last edited by Macbeth (2011-08-03 00:39:25)

Varegg
Support fanatic :-)
+2,206|6852|Nårvei

Even though they keep the credit rating for now they may just lower it later this year ... as I understand this all depends on the final decisions regarding long term cuts and that will not be easy to put together seeing as democrats have a hard time cutting costs in social services and republicans will not cut military spending or raise taxes ...

Bipartisan talks will be put to the test, I hope your politicians get how important it is to set aside pride and get a good long term solution ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6148|eXtreme to the maX

RAIMIUS wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
Most countries also have terribly trained forces, or not enough logistics to keep fighting for more than a couple weeks....

Reference the UK and their "seasonal" carrier planning, Tomahawk shortage in Libya, and lack of trained Eurofighter strike pilots. 
...and the UK has one of the more respected militaries in the world!
Well, the cold war ended a while ago, British armed forces have been extensively engaged for over a decade now, and they weren't really designed to fight more than a few weeks as thats the probable maximum length of any future major conflict.

Meddling in three ME countiries simultaneously was never in the plan for the current British military.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6643|132 and Bush

https://i.imgur.com/8NyqQ.jpg
Harry Reid On Debt Ceiling Talks: GOP Leaders 'Still Refuse To Negotiate In Good Faith' (VIDEO)

Showdown On Debt Talks--Editorial
"The only reason this balanced approach isn't on its way to becoming law right now is because a significant number of Republicans in Congress are insisting on a cuts-only approach" and won't "ask the wealthiest Americans or biggest corporations to c…
New York Post
posted on Jul 26, 2011  ·
John Boehner Is Terrible At His Job
Unable to control his Republican caucus amid a Tea Party revolt, House Speaker John Boehner was forced to indefinitely postpone a vote on his debt ceiling bill. The abrupt move to pull the bill from consideration was a stunning setback for Boehner, shifting emphasis over to the Senate Democratic pl ...
Debt Ceiling Standoff: Time To Panic? [link]

Stocks around the world were weighed down early Monday as investors grew increasingly worried that congressional leaders and President Obama would not be able to strike a debt deal in time to avert a financial disaster. Talks between President Obama…
Debt Limit Talks Lead To Rise Of Tea Party Schizophrenics And Hobbits

Obama: Debt Ceiling Talks Fell Apart, Boehner Walked Out [link]

WASHINGTON -- Social Security and Medicare may have been saved by the Tea Party's refusal to accept President Barack Obama's "grand bargain." On Friday evening, Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) walked away from the latest offer on the table by Obama, w
Top 9 Lies In Obama’s Debt Ceiling Speech [link]

It seems like we’ve been talking about the debt ceiling for an awfully long time. Probably because we have been talking about the debt ceiling for an awfully long time. President Obama made a primetime appearance on Monday night to address the natio…
Obama Warns Cantor 'Don't Call My Bluff' As Debt Talks Stall [link]

WASHINGTON -- Lawmakers and the White House had what nearly every party is describing as a "tough" and "testy" meeting on the debt ceiling Wednesday afternoon, culminating in a stormy exchange between President Barack Obama and House Majority
John Boehner Leaves Debt Ceiling Talks With Obama[link]

House Speaker John Boehner has broken off talks with President Barack Obama on getting a budget deal to avert a government default. The Ohio Republican says the president wants to raise taxes too high and won'

Desperation (Not Deal-Making) Takes Hold In Debt Talks [link]

Despite President Obama's threat to veto the bill, House Republicans are moving forward on their "cut, cap, and balance" plan, a proposal that allows the debt ceiling to rise only if Congress passes a constitutional amendment requiring a balanced bu
Obama Gets Angry As Debt Limit Talks Fall Apart
Goodwin: Obama Takes Nation's Citizens For Fools [link]

When President Obama started talking at his news conference Monday, I listened intently for 15 minutes or so. Then I got fidgety as his half-truths about the debt grew into full-blown whoppers. As he droned on, I did something I never did before dur…
Debt Ceiling Talks Continue, Washington Grinds To A Standstill
Obama Storms Out Of Debt Meeting?: Amid Stalemate, Debt Talks Grow Heated [link]

The best quote from the roughly 40-minute presser, however, came after a reporter asked if Obama still has hope that a deal can get done. The president's response: "I always have hope. Don’t you remember my campaign?"
Republicans Divided Over McConnell's 'Surrender' To Obama On Debt Ceiling

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's startling offer to hand near total control of the debt ceiling to President Obama is drawing condemnation from conservatives and tea party activists, even as Speaker John Boehner admits he doesn't have the votes to pass any form of raising the debt ceiling i ...
Eric Cantor: Debt-Ceiling Obstructionist [link]

Tags: GOP debt ceiling Limbaugh wants obama to fail Obama and Republicans Politics Republicans and debt ceiling debt ceiling negotiations eric cantor eric cantor and budget talks jack white rightwatch Digg Twitter MySpace …
HUFFPOST HILL - President: Yeah, These Debt Talks Aren't Going Anywhere
Jim DeMint Calls Treasury Secretary 'Irresponsible' On Debt Talk
Boehner: Debt Ceiling Talks With White House 'Like Dealing With Jell-O'
https://i.imgur.com/1YGH6.jpg
World Tells Us What It Really Thinks About Our 'Absurd' Debt Crisis

News outlets today, no doubt exhausted from aggregating the reactions of angry American pushed over the edge with aggravation over the debt ceiling debate, have now turned to aggregating the angry reactions of the world at large. Things don't look great from inside the country; it turns out they don't look that great from outside, either. Consider the commentary from abroad:

The UK: "Even by the notoriously fractious standards of Capitol Hill, the high-stakes game of brinkmanship playing out over the debt crisis has looked like a political system gone mad," indicates an editorial in the Telegraph. "[i]nternational confidence in America’s ability to resolve its problems has fallen to an all-time low... Two centuries of accumulated advantage risk being squandered in a few months of political insanity." And Richard Adams at Guardian adds: [A]ppeals to common sense are of little use..."

Germany:  “What America is currently exhibiting is the worst kind of absurd theatrics and the whole world is being held hostage… Most importantly, the Republicans have turned a dispute over a technicality into a religious war, which no longer has any relation to a reasonable dispute between the elected government and the opposition,” writes the German mass-circulation Bild, (via Think Progress).

France:  "The American politicians supposed to lead the most powerful nation in the world are becoming a laughing stock,” -- notes Le Monde (via Think Progress).

Russia: "[b]itterly partisan," described The Moscow Times, quoting one anonymous investor as saying ""if the U.S. debt situation is not solved we are all screwed — there will be no winners and losers."

Europe, generally: “One could now ask why is the U.S. debt treated any better than a country like Portugal, which has about the same levels of deficit and debt,” said a senior European policymaker to the Times, on condition of anonymity.

China: We've discussed how China's state run media has been heckling us over the debt ceiling. In short, as The New York Times reports, Xinhua said the “irresponsible” brinksmanship in Washington risked “strangling the still fragile economic recovery of not only the United States but also the world as a whole.”

India: "An acrimonious stalemate, with both sides offering competing plans that are unlikely to win bipartisan support" describes the Times of India
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6148|eXtreme to the maX
Its both funny, sad and scary.
Your shitty two-party system just isn't working.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6643|132 and Bush

It's funny to hear people now using this as an example of it actually working.. It could be a 12 party system and it would be the same. It's the cult of politics, and virtually every country deals with it on some level.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6643|132 and Bush

btw, i cut that list way short.. and all of those links were major trending stories/links.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6148|eXtreme to the maX
For whatever reason then, the system isn't working.

A rating downgrade on $15trillion of debt is going to hurt, now wouldn't it have been better to sort out any disagreements quickly and behind closed doors like adults?
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Varegg
Support fanatic :-)
+2,206|6852|Nårvei

Kmar wrote:

It's funny to hear people now using this as an example of it actually working.. It could be a 12 party system and it would be the same. It's the cult of politics, and virtually every country deals with it on some level.
I agree.

The amount of parties doesn't matter in this case, it would basically be between two political blocks either way ...

What's scary is that none of those blocks are willing to work together properly in the best interest of the American people, political pride is more important and bipartisan talks suffer ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6453|'Murka

Cybargs wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
And most countries don't have the international security obligations of the US. So not so bizarre, if you look more than a millimeter deep.
4% GDP military spending isn't that high... Besides most of it is pay to servicemen and veteran benefits.

Singapore is spending roughly the same on GDP and no one seems to be bitching.
But but but but...you're wrong! US defense spending is OUTRAGEOUS! OUTRAGEOUS, I tell you!

I have no facts to support my opinion, but I hold it strongly, nonetheless!
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6453|'Murka

Dilbert_X wrote:

RAIMIUS wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

And most countries spend less than 3 weeks income on defence, spending 3 months worth is bizarre.
Most countries also have terribly trained forces, or not enough logistics to keep fighting for more than a couple weeks....

Reference the UK and their "seasonal" carrier planning, Tomahawk shortage in Libya, and lack of trained Eurofighter strike pilots. 
...and the UK has one of the more respected militaries in the world!
Well, the cold war ended a while ago, British armed forces have been extensively engaged for over a decade now, and they weren't really designed to fight more than a few weeks as thats the probable maximum length of any future major conflict.

Meddling in three ME countiries simultaneously was never in the plan for the current British military.
Irony is ironic.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6453|'Murka

Dilbert_X wrote:

Its both funny, sad and scary.
Your shitty two-party system just isn't working.
It would appear we have three parties in power right now.

Seriously. This drumbeat is so old.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5400|London, England

Dilbert_X wrote:

Its both funny, sad and scary.
Your shitty two-party system just isn't working.
How would having a third party change it? Protip: it wouldn't. It's not the fault of the system, it's the fault of the politicians attracted to politics in the first place.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6148|eXtreme to the maX

Jay wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Its both funny, sad and scary.
Your shitty two-party system just isn't working.
How would having a third party change it? Protip: it wouldn't. It's not the fault of the system, it's the fault of the politicians attracted to politics in the first place.
Having two parties in constant opposition does not make for rational govt.
Having two parties trying to see how extreme a position they can take to counterbalance the extreme stance taken by the other party is asinine.

With a reasonable cross-section of parties in govt and no one party having total power everyone is used to cutting deals to gt things done, instead of ranting at each other and running off to 'he said she said' interviews on TV.

Politicians who have no experience of bi-partisan deals fail badly when one is needed - as we saw over the last few weeks, which amounted to nothing more intelligent than umpteen day of 'no u!' shouted ever louder until the inevitable compromise was reached.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!

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