Besides, God created Adam and Eve.
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- Should the Catholic Church remove chasitity for Priests?
If God created Adam and Eve, who was created by Adam and Eve... and who did they procreate with?
On topic, Priests know what they're getting into when they join up, if they can't do it then just leave. It's about devotion. And nobody is forcing them to do anything.
On topic, Priests know what they're getting into when they join up, if they can't do it then just leave. It's about devotion. And nobody is forcing them to do anything.
Last edited by Mekstizzle (2010-03-14 13:32:12)
Didn't someone say that starting a thread in DS&T isn't just a matter of posting some question and sitting back to watch the fireworks?
What's the point of this one? Something in the news? You have an opinion yerself? What?
Personally I couldn't care less, if people want to live their lives not having sex wtf should anyone else care?
What's the point of this one? Something in the news? You have an opinion yerself? What?
Personally I couldn't care less, if people want to live their lives not having sex wtf should anyone else care?
Last edited by ruisleipa (2010-03-14 13:32:38)
The whole chastity among priests thing was never really designed to make the priests closer to god, it was a way to cut down on the nepotism that was widespread on the outposts of the Catholic church. The title of priest was becoming hereditary. So yes, it's outdated.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
They aren't allowed to rub one out. So what's that leave? Farm animals?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Let them marry... that will fix a myriad of problems all by itself.
The fact that other branches of Christianity don't have the same issues with child molestation speaks for itself.
yes.
You dont hear about priests that can marry and have children (anglican as an example) abusing children.
Yes I agree that by being a catholic priest you have to control yourself and all that stuff but it goes against human nature.
I cannot see the catholic church changing it anytime soon as they are basically stickibng their heads in sand and going "la la la la la I cant hear you!"
Yes I agree that by being a catholic priest you have to control yourself and all that stuff but it goes against human nature.
I cannot see the catholic church changing it anytime soon as they are basically stickibng their heads in sand and going "la la la la la I cant hear you!"
You have proof of this, or is it that the Catholic Church is a larger target and therefore easier to attack?ghettoperson wrote:
The fact that other branches of Christianity don't have the same issues with child molestation speaks for itself.
jamiecracker wrote:
You dont hear about priests that can marry and have children (anglican as an example) abusing children.
Yes I agree that by being a catholic priest you have to control yourself and all that stuff but it goes against human nature.
I cannot see the catholic church changing it anytime soon as they are basically stickibng their heads in sand and going "la la la la la I cant hear you!"
taken from here http://www.anglican.org.au/docs/Study%2 … Report.pdfThe report analyses 191 alleged cases of child sexual abuse, reported from 17 dioceses throughout Australia between 1990 and 2008
As for the OP
No, and I think you meant Celibacy. And even at that, no. A Catholic priest is married to the church, and is to remain celibate so as to better serve God.
If you are asking this question due to the abuse scandals, keep in mind that the scandals are prevalent in more than the Catholic church, yet only the Catholic churches require celibacy. Search google for any other denomination and sexual abuse and you will find just as many cases of it, only not as widely newsworthy because the Catholic church is a larger target.
No, and I think you meant Celibacy. And even at that, no. A Catholic priest is married to the church, and is to remain celibate so as to better serve God.
If you are asking this question due to the abuse scandals, keep in mind that the scandals are prevalent in more than the Catholic church, yet only the Catholic churches require celibacy. Search google for any other denomination and sexual abuse and you will find just as many cases of it, only not as widely newsworthy because the Catholic church is a larger target.
You're still dodging the fact that celibacy makes no sense whatsoever to expect out of a human being for the entirety of his life. Biology, in and of itself, requires that we sate our sexual urges -- whether through marriage, masturbation, or otherwise.Canin wrote:
As for the OP
No, and I think you meant Celibacy. And even at that, no. A Catholic priest is married to the church, and is to remain celibate so as to better serve God.
If you are asking this question due to the abuse scandals, keep in mind that the scandals are prevalent in more than the Catholic church, yet only the Catholic churches require celibacy. Search google for any other denomination and sexual abuse and you will find just as many cases of it, only not as widely newsworthy because the Catholic church is a larger target.
And then of course, there's the fact that the only reason this was really put into place was because of politics and nepotism, it's clearly a very outdated rule.
Logically, it really cannot be defended. Then again, neither can the stereotypical Catholic view of contraception.
Catholicism 202: Ignoring reality.turq wrote:
You're still dodging the fact that celibacy makes no sense whatsoever
I am not dodging anything, Celibacy is required for those in the priesthood. You don't want to or can't be celibate, then you don't become a priest. In the Catholic church being a priest is a calling, its not for everyone. It is mandated by Catholic Law.Turquoise wrote:
You're still dodging the fact that celibacy makes no sense whatsoever to expect out of a human being for the entirety of his life. Biology, in and of itself, requires that we sate our sexual urges -- whether through marriage, masturbation, or otherwise.Canin wrote:
As for the OP
No, and I think you meant Celibacy. And even at that, no. A Catholic priest is married to the church, and is to remain celibate so as to better serve God.
If you are asking this question due to the abuse scandals, keep in mind that the scandals are prevalent in more than the Catholic church, yet only the Catholic churches require celibacy. Search google for any other denomination and sexual abuse and you will find just as many cases of it, only not as widely newsworthy because the Catholic church is a larger target.
And then of course, there's the fact that the only reason this was really put into place was because of politics and nepotism, it's clearly a very outdated rule.
Logically, it really cannot be defended. Then again, neither can the stereotypical Catholic view of contraception.
I don't know why those who are not Catholic even care so much. Again, if it is due to the abuse scandal, best to look at humanity as a whole, rather than pin point one religion, as it is a farther reaching issue.
I understand that's how your religion works, but I'm just saying that law in particular is really... really... outdated. I'll agree that it's not just Catholics though. Any religion that demands lifelong celibacy is outdated or just unrealistic.Canin wrote:
I am not dodging anything, Celibacy is required for those in the priesthood. You don't want to or can't be celibate, then you don't become a priest. In the Catholic church being a priest is a calling, its not for everyone. It is mandated by Catholic Law.
I don't know why those who are not Catholic even care so much. Again, if it is due to the abuse scandal, best to look at humanity as a whole, rather than pin point one religion, as it is a farther reaching issue.
Whose reality Mac? Yours? Turquoises? Mine? It is a religion, one which I follow and believe in. I find it humorous that those here that have shown to have no faith in anything are the ones that like to pick at the Faith of others. Its almost as if you can't find yours so you have to belittle others to bring them down to your level.Marlo Stanfield wrote:
Catholicism 202: Ignoring reality.turq wrote:
You're still dodging the fact that celibacy makes no sense whatsoever
I'm not trying to bring anyone down. I'm trying to raise you up to my level, I have transcended humanity and become the ubermensch. God is dead and I'm setting new values here.Canin wrote:
Whose reality Mac? Yours? Turquoises? Mine? It is a religion, one which I follow and believe in. I find it humorous that those here that have shown to have no faith in anything are the ones that like to pick at the Faith of others. Its almost as if you can't find yours so you have to belittle others to bring them down to your level.Marlo Stanfield wrote:
Catholicism 202: Ignoring reality.turq wrote:
You're still dodging the fact that celibacy makes no sense whatsoever
Thanks, I am done with you, you can't or won't rebut me seriously, so I am through with you.Marlo Stanfield wrote:
I'm not trying to bring anyone down. I'm trying to raise you up to my level, I have transcended humanity and become the ubermensch. God is dead and I'm setting new values here.Canin wrote:
Whose reality Mac? Yours? Turquoises? Mine? It is a religion, one which I follow and believe in. I find it humorous that those here that have shown to have no faith in anything are the ones that like to pick at the Faith of others. Its almost as if you can't find yours so you have to belittle others to bring them down to your level.Marlo Stanfield wrote:
Catholicism 202: Ignoring reality.
I understand what you're saying man. Some people are like that. I'm not one of those "adamant atheists" that attack all religious people.Canin wrote:
Whose reality Mac? Yours? Turquoises? Mine? It is a religion, one which I follow and believe in. I find it humorous that those here that have shown to have no faith in anything are the ones that like to pick at the Faith of others. Its almost as if you can't find yours so you have to belittle others to bring them down to your level.Marlo Stanfield wrote:
Catholicism 202: Ignoring reality.turq wrote:
You're still dodging the fact that celibacy makes no sense whatsoever
It's just that, because I have no religion, I don't have any sacred topics. To me, anything and everything should be open to discussion and debate. Sometimes, I realize it offends people, but my intention is to forward logic and pragmatism -- not to push people with dogma.
I was being completely serious.Canin wrote:
Thanks, I am done with you, you can't or won't rebut me seriously, so I am through with you.Marlo Stanfield wrote:
I'm not trying to bring anyone down. I'm trying to raise you up to my level, I have transcended humanity and become the ubermensch. God is dead and I'm setting new values here.Canin wrote:
Whose reality Mac? Yours? Turquoises? Mine? It is a religion, one which I follow and believe in. I find it humorous that those here that have shown to have no faith in anything are the ones that like to pick at the Faith of others. Its almost as if you can't find yours so you have to belittle others to bring them down to your level.
I don't have a problem with the Catholic church, heck my gf is Catholic. The very premise for celibacy among the priesthood is outdated as I said previously in this thread. You may feel as though people are picking on your faith but show me another sect that has had such massive and widespread issues with child abuse? While you're at it, show me a sect that has the same celibacy rules for it's leaders. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to put two and two together and figure out that the vow of celibacy was a prime mover in the child abuse issues that your church has faced.Canin wrote:
Thanks, I am done with you, you can't or won't rebut me seriously, so I am through with you.
For a church that denounces same-sex relationships and puts heterosexuals up as it's ideal, you'd think the leadership would want to set an example.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
I already listed one previously, in rebuttle to the Anglican church not having issues, and that was localized to Australia. Every church, school and institution is having problems with child abuse. All you have to do is search google and you can find a plethora of them. I know you are smart enough to do that G@lt, I have read your posts and tend to agree with you on most of them. However, everyone likes to paint the Catholic church with a broad brush when it comes to child abuse being solely its problem and it just is not the case.JohnG@lt wrote:
I don't have a problem with the Catholic church, heck my gf is Catholic. The very premise for celibacy among the priesthood is outdated as I said previously in this thread. You may feel as though people are picking on your faith but show me another sect that has had such massive and widespread issues with child abuse? While you're at it, show me a sect that has the same celibacy rules for it's leaders. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to put two and two together and figure out that the vow of celibacy was a prime mover in the child abuse issues that your church has faced.Canin wrote:
Thanks, I am done with you, you can't or won't rebut me seriously, so I am through with you.
For a church that denounces same-sex relationships and puts heterosexuals up as it's ideal, you'd think the leadership would want to set an example.
I can only go off my own experiences and I happen to live in a densely Catholic part of the country (most of the area is Italian, Irish or southern German) and there have been a lot of problems. The Rockville Center diocese here was hit with a $150M lawsuit, St. Patricks Cathedral in Manhattan had issues etc. Sure, these are a minority of churches in the region but they've gotten a lot of print over the years.Canin wrote:
I already listed one previously, in rebuttle to the Anglican church not having issues, and that was localized to Australia. Every church, school and institution is having problems with child abuse. All you have to do is search google and you can find a plethora of them. I know you are smart enough to do that G@lt, I have read your posts and tend to agree with you on most of them. However, everyone likes to paint the Catholic church with a broad brush when it comes to child abuse being solely its problem and it just is not the case.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
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