Poll

Should NASA prepare for potential asteroid threat before the moon?

Go to the Moon first32%32% - 11
Set asteroid as top priority50%50% - 17
Advance Orion asteroid mission5%5% - 2
Allow Earth to be hit by NEO11%11% - 4
Total: 34
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

Thread inspiration.
https://i43.tinypic.com/oadu2p.jpg

Threatening asteroid Apophis a possible target for NASA’s Orion Asteroid Mission.
Apophis is a large asteroid which is expected to make unusually close approaches to Earth. It is a potential target for NASA’s Orion Asteroid Mission, in which a modified Altair lunar lander will land crewmembers on a near-Earth asteroid.

At the moment, the mission is expected to not take place until long after Orion 15/Altair 2 has landed on the Moon. I am coming to the conclusion that, notwithstanding the possibility of mining helium 3 from the Moon for use in fusion reactors as a source of cheap and clean energy, more attention must be paid to dealing with the potential asteroid threat - not only from Apophis in 2036, but also from other fast moving asteroids, many of which are not detected until they have nearly arrived. In the last few weeks, two asteroids have approached Earth within 1.3 lunar distances, and recently one arrived not much further from us than the altitude of a geostationary satellite. In October 2008, an asteroid exploded over a desert in Africa.
https://i44.tinypic.com/210k39x.jpg

Whether Apophis will be a threat to us in 2036 is not fully known. There is a gravitational keyhole near Earth about 600 metres across. If Apophis passes through this in 2029, it is more likely that it will collide with Earth in 2036.

“An equivalent way of describing the problem of computing an impact probability for Apophis is that the true 2029 “keyhole” leading to a 2036 impact - as distinct from the theoretical keyhole derived from the Standard Dynamical Model - is not known in the absence of knowledge of the complete dynamics. The problem is acute enough for Apophis that, IF impact hasn’t been previously excluded, AND there hasn’t been a through physical characterization, it can’t be known for certain it will impact until during or after the 2029 encounter, even if a spacecraft is accompanying Apophis and providing position measurements good to 2 meters. That is, the keyhole could be determined only retrospectively, after passage through it.” - http://neo.jpl.nasa.gov/apophis/
Of the four asteroids in our neighborhood today, 2009 HS44 is the closest, approaching us at closest distance of 0.0118 AU or ~1.76 million miles. It's between 42 and 95 across and is travelling at about 40,332 mph, so it's faster than usual, although the estimated speed of asteroid 2009 HE21 is 63,372 mph - it's nearly three times larger in diameter, but will be further away, making its close approach on April 30. Today's 2009 HS44 asteroid is the closest known in the next 5 months, and the 2009 HE21 asteroid of April 30 the fastest.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Poseidon
Fudgepack DeQueef
+3,253|6805|Long Island, New York
Don't we have a few systems proposed/in place that wouldn't even cost much money?

I remember one was deflecting it (the asteroid) using gigantic sails...

But all in all, I'd say prepare for the asteroid.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

Poseidon wrote:

Don't we have a few systems proposed/in place that wouldn't even cost much money?

I remember one was deflecting it (the asteroid) using gigantic sails...

But all in all, I'd say prepare for the asteroid.
NASA's budget is so small (less than 1% of the total federal budget) that just predicting and preparing for an impact would require nearly all of their resources.
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Superior Mind
(not macbeth)
+1,755|6960
I say go to the moon first. We have 27 years to prepare for the asteroid. If we go to the moon and start mining for helium 3 sooner then perhaps we will secure a more stable environment to explore space technologies.
S.Lythberg
Mastermind
+429|6715|Chicago, IL
A rouge extrasolar object could impact earth at any second, having a contingency plan is good, but standing at cold-war style readiness is a waste
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

S.Lythberg wrote:

A rouge extrasolar object could impact earth at any second, having a contingency plan is good, but standing at cold-war style readiness is a waste
Standing at cold war style? It's not could hit, something will hit. The point of the thread is to question our astronomical priorities. Although the moon option could actually prove profitable. However, if a 2036 impact happens time is an issue.
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S.Lythberg
Mastermind
+429|6715|Chicago, IL

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

A rouge extrasolar object could impact earth at any second, having a contingency plan is good, but standing at cold-war style readiness is a waste
Standing at cold war style? It's not could hit, something will hit. The point of the thread is to question our astronomical priorities. Although the moon option could actually prove profitable. However, if a 2036 impact happens time is an issue.
It is an issue, but diverting all of NASA's funds to stopping an unlikely event is not feasible
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

A rouge extrasolar object could impact earth at any second, having a contingency plan is good, but standing at cold-war style readiness is a waste
Standing at cold war style? It's not could hit, something will hit. The point of the thread is to question our astronomical priorities. Although the moon option could actually prove profitable. However, if a 2036 impact happens time is an issue.
It is an issue, but diverting all of NASA's funds to stopping an unlikely event is not feasible
Unlikely you say? We only track a very small percentage of the sky. Objects like the tunguska event (about the size of a bus) aren't even looked at.
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thraSK
Best ___ in Aus
+57|6250
Alright Australia!
Diesel_dyk
Object in mirror will feel larger than it appears
+178|6262|Truthistan
Go to the moon first to get Helium 3

They say Helium 3 can be used to make commerical fusion reactor a reality. It has the potential to solve earth's energy problems.
Part of mining the moon would be setting up a base there and for there space exploration is inevitable.

From the moon we can work on the asteriod problem.
imortal
Member
+240|6933|Austin, TX
Okay, pretty simplistic ways of looking at this issue, but it dilutes things out.  First, developing the technology and techniques for a permenant colony on the moon may very well have practical applications for astroid detection and interception.  The two are not mutually exclusive.  Also, project support (and financial support) always peaks when there is the detection of an object that may hit the earth, but the support wanes whenever it is determined that we are safe.  The moon is always there, overhead, mocking us.  Therefore, more steady funding.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

It's kinda funny fckedup that survival really relies on money when you think about it. We have the physical resources, the man power, and the potential technology already in place.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
S.Lythberg
Mastermind
+429|6715|Chicago, IL

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Standing at cold war style? It's not could hit, something will hit. The point of the thread is to question our astronomical priorities. Although the moon option could actually prove profitable. However, if a 2036 impact happens time is an issue.
It is an issue, but diverting all of NASA's funds to stopping an unlikely event is not feasible
Unlikely you say? We only track a very small percentage of the sky. Objects like the tunguska event (about the size of a bus) aren't even looked at.
apophis is unlikely, but another smaller and faster object could easily evade detection, that was sort of my point, that attempting to monitor and project the paths of all threatening objects is futile, and would only serve to divert valuable funds
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

It is an issue, but diverting all of NASA's funds to stopping an unlikely event is not feasible
Unlikely you say? We only track a very small percentage of the sky. Objects like the tunguska event (about the size of a bus) aren't even looked at.
apophis is unlikely, but another smaller and faster object could easily evade detection, that was sort of my point, that attempting to monitor and project the paths of all threatening objects is futile, and would only serve to divert valuable funds
We really wont know until the first pass. There are numbers out there but those numbers are missing tons of key data in their calculations. That is the point of further research. Make no mistake these missions are being planned. Not until after 2030 though. @ 6.9 million miles that is easily going to be the furthest man has traveled away from the earth. The idea of the orion mission is to find out more about these orbits in general. .. not just Apophis.

I really don't know btw. I came across the question and found it to be especially interesting. Just getting opinions.
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S.Lythberg
Mastermind
+429|6715|Chicago, IL

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Unlikely you say? We only track a very small percentage of the sky. Objects like the tunguska event (about the size of a bus) aren't even looked at.
apophis is unlikely, but another smaller and faster object could easily evade detection, that was sort of my point, that attempting to monitor and project the paths of all threatening objects is futile, and would only serve to divert valuable funds
We really wont know until the first pass. There are numbers out there but those numbers are missing tons of key data in their calculations. That is the point of further research. Make no mistake these missions are being planned. Not until after 2030 though. @ 6.9 million miles that is easily going to be the furthest man has traveled away from the earth. The idea of the orion mission is to find out more about these orbits in general. .. not just Apophis.

I really don't know btw. I came across the question and found it to be especially interesting. Just getting opinions.
Obviously the threat exists, but right now the money is better spent (imo) on the moon and other planets

Last edited by S.Lythberg (2009-04-28 20:52:27)

Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

apophis is unlikely, but another smaller and faster object could easily evade detection, that was sort of my point, that attempting to monitor and project the paths of all threatening objects is futile, and would only serve to divert valuable funds
We really wont know until the first pass. There are numbers out there but those numbers are missing tons of key data in their calculations. That is the point of further research. Make no mistake these missions are being planned. Not until after 2030 though. @ 6.9 million miles that is easily going to be the furthest man has traveled away from the earth. The idea of the orion mission is to find out more about these orbits in general. .. not just Apophis.

I really don't know btw. I came across the question and found it to be especially interesting. Just getting opinions.
Obviously the threat exists, but right now the money is better spent (imo) on the moon and other planets
Hey, the moon is leaving us at 1 cm a year and the sun is going to swallow us.. Whateva floats ya boat.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Narupug
Fodder Mostly
+150|5864|Vacationland

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


We really wont know until the first pass. There are numbers out there but those numbers are missing tons of key data in their calculations. That is the point of further research. Make no mistake these missions are being planned. Not until after 2030 though. @ 6.9 million miles that is easily going to be the furthest man has traveled away from the earth. The idea of the orion mission is to find out more about these orbits in general. .. not just Apophis.

I really don't know btw. I came across the question and found it to be especially interesting. Just getting opinions.
Obviously the threat exists, but right now the money is better spent (imo) on the moon and other planets
Hey, the moon is leaving us at 1 cm a year and the sun is going to swallow us.. Whateva floats ya boat.
Yeah and whenever it falls out of orbit we're pretty much screwed, the earth would have too much wobble to be habitable, that is if it doesn't catch something else big which could cause other wierd issues.  Bottom line it's stupid to depend on this planet too much cause there are just too many ways it can become uninhabitable or be destroyed.  One interesting idea is to terraform Mars .
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

Narupug wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

Obviously the threat exists, but right now the money is better spent (imo) on the moon and other planets
Hey, the moon is leaving us at 1 cm a year and the sun is going to swallow us.. Whateva floats ya boat.
Yeah and whenever it falls out of orbit we're pretty much screwed, the earth would have too much wobble to be habitable, that is if it doesn't catch something else big which could cause other wierd issues.  Bottom line it's stupid to depend on this planet too much cause there are just too many ways it can become uninhabitable or be destroyed.  One interesting idea is to terraform Mars .
Well, it's a one way ticket in any case. Big Rip, big crunch, big bounce, big freeze .. take your pick. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
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imortal
Member
+240|6933|Austin, TX

Kmarion wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


We really wont know until the first pass. There are numbers out there but those numbers are missing tons of key data in their calculations. That is the point of further research. Make no mistake these missions are being planned. Not until after 2030 though. @ 6.9 million miles that is easily going to be the furthest man has traveled away from the earth. The idea of the orion mission is to find out more about these orbits in general. .. not just Apophis.

I really don't know btw. I came across the question and found it to be especially interesting. Just getting opinions.
Obviously the threat exists, but right now the money is better spent (imo) on the moon and other planets
Hey, the moon is leaving us at 1 cm a year and the sun is going to swallow us.. Whateva floats ya boat.
Yeah, but by then the super caldera under Yellowstone will have killed me.
Narupug
Fodder Mostly
+150|5864|Vacationland

Kmarion wrote:

Narupug wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Hey, the moon is leaving us at 1 cm a year and the sun is going to swallow us.. Whateva floats ya boat.
Yeah and whenever it falls out of orbit we're pretty much screwed, the earth would have too much wobble to be habitable, that is if it doesn't catch something else big which could cause other wierd issues.  Bottom line it's stupid to depend on this planet too much cause there are just too many ways it can become uninhabitable or be destroyed.  One interesting idea is to terraform Mars .
Well, it's a one way ticket in any case. Big Rip, big crunch, big bounce, big freeze .. take your pick. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
Well if we wanna keep existing as a race, basic instinct, then we need to take into account the that if we concentrate our entire species on one planet then we run the risk of being wiped out in one shot.  If we expand and set up on other planets throughout the solar system and possibly one day throughout the galaxy then we can survive as a race even if one planet is wiped out.
It is worthy noting though that even if we spread throughout the galaxy, the Andromeda and the Milky way galaxies are predicted to collide in a couple billion years, this would most likely wipe us out no matter how far spread out in the Milk Way Galaxy we can become.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

Narupug wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Narupug wrote:

Yeah and whenever it falls out of orbit we're pretty much screwed, the earth would have too much wobble to be habitable, that is if it doesn't catch something else big which could cause other wierd issues.  Bottom line it's stupid to depend on this planet too much cause there are just too many ways it can become uninhabitable or be destroyed.  One interesting idea is to terraform Mars .
Well, it's a one way ticket in any case. Big Rip, big crunch, big bounce, big freeze .. take your pick. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
Well if we wanna keep existing as a race, basic instinct, then we need to take into account the that if we concentrate our entire species on one planet then we run the risk of being wiped out in one shot.  If we expand and set up on other planets throughout the solar system and possibly one day throughout the galaxy then we can survive as a race even if one planet is wiped out.
It is worthy noting though that even if we spread throughout the galaxy, the Andromeda and the Milky way galaxies are predicted to collide in a couple billion years, this would most likely wipe us out no matter how far spread out in the Milk Way Galaxy we can become.
The Andromeda collision itself would happen over millions of years. It's not like a car accident. .. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
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Narupug
Fodder Mostly
+150|5864|Vacationland

Kmarion wrote:

Narupug wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Well, it's a one way ticket in any case. Big Rip, big crunch, big bounce, big freeze .. take your pick. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
Well if we wanna keep existing as a race, basic instinct, then we need to take into account the that if we concentrate our entire species on one planet then we run the risk of being wiped out in one shot.  If we expand and set up on other planets throughout the solar system and possibly one day throughout the galaxy then we can survive as a race even if one planet is wiped out.
It is worthy noting though that even if we spread throughout the galaxy, the Andromeda and the Milky way galaxies are predicted to collide in a couple billion years, this would most likely wipe us out no matter how far spread out in the Milk Way Galaxy we can become.
The Andromeda collision itself would happen over millions of years. It's not like a car accident. .. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
Once it's over we'll most likely be finished.  Yeah I'm just saying expanding to other planets will probably be neccessary to keeping the ride going, so why not start on it now.
Lotta_Drool
Spit
+350|6451|Ireland
Whenever life gets you down Mrs. Brown, just remember this.......

notorious
Nay vee, bay bee.
+1,396|7015|The United Center
If anyone needs me, I'll be building my bunker.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6869|132 and Bush

Narupug wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Narupug wrote:

Well if we wanna keep existing as a race, basic instinct, then we need to take into account the that if we concentrate our entire species on one planet then we run the risk of being wiped out in one shot.  If we expand and set up on other planets throughout the solar system and possibly one day throughout the galaxy then we can survive as a race even if one planet is wiped out.
It is worthy noting though that even if we spread throughout the galaxy, the Andromeda and the Milky way galaxies are predicted to collide in a couple billion years, this would most likely wipe us out no matter how far spread out in the Milk Way Galaxy we can become.
The Andromeda collision itself would happen over millions of years. It's not like a car accident. .. We're just trying to squeeze as much as possible out of this ride.
Once it's over we'll most likely be finished.  Yeah I'm just saying expanding to other planets will probably be neccessary to keeping the ride going, so why not start on it now.
Essentially we are. Every time the shuttle goes up we gain a little more knowledge. The research we are doing at the ISS is preparing us for things like intergalactic/planetary travel and the effects on the human body.
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